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Old 12-30-2009, 12:45 PM   #1
Alec Corper
 
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Dilemma

One of the great/awful things about Aikido is that you can always find a teacher who is as nutty/enlightened/ as you are, thereby ensuring that whatever you do can always be described as "Aikido". Seeing as how most Shihans don't want to define Aikido (could be health system, Budo, self development, self defense, art form, shugyo, etc., etc.) nobody knows what the hell they are doing, except insofar as they define it for themselves and their way of practicing their image of aikido fits in the dojo they are part of, or at least, for the time being. This is great/terrible unless/until we bump into other realities/assumptions that force/persuade us to redefine/re-anesthetize ourselves in order to continue along our chosen path/maze.
Every time I log on i get invited to post and mostly what I read reminds me not to make a fool of myself again, but being a fool I couldn't resist.
BTW when you read the above paragraph pick whatever variations you like in order to generate something worth arguing with

If your temper rises withdraw your hand, if your hand rises withdraw your temper.
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Old 12-30-2009, 01:19 PM   #2
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Alec Corper wrote: View Post
One of the great/awful things about Aikido is that you can always find a teacher who is as nutty/enlightened/ as you are, thereby ensuring that whatever you do can always be described as "Aikido". Seeing as how most Shihans don't want to define Aikido (could be health system, Budo, self development, self defense, art form, shugyo, etc., etc.) nobody knows what the hell they are doing, except insofar as they define it for themselves and their way of practicing their image of aikido fits in the dojo they are part of, or at least, for the time being. This is great/terrible unless/until we bump into other realities/assumptions that force/persuade us to redefine/re-anesthetize ourselves in order to continue along our chosen path/maze.
Every time I log on i get invited to post and mostly what I read reminds me not to make a fool of myself again, but being a fool I couldn't resist.
BTW when you read the above paragraph pick whatever variations you like in order to generate something worth arguing with
I disagree most fervently! Most fervently indeed! I'm not sure with what yet, but I'm working on it, give me more time.
Wait I think I've found something! In your second to last paragraph you say that it is because you are a fool that you keep making a fool out of yourself. I disagree! Assuming for the moment we're not talking about you directly, I think it can actually be quite wise to make a fool of yourself. How else can other less foolish people provide that enlightenment you seek? Seriously. Besides! Shirley, it's a valuable public service to demonstrate what not to do!
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Last edited by mathewjgano : 12-30-2009 at 01:22 PM.

Gambarimashyo!
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Old 12-30-2009, 01:46 PM   #3
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Re: Dilemma

So, I got the following possible combinations:

This is great unless we bump into other realities that force us to redefine ourselves in order to continue along our chosen path.
This is great unless we bump into other realities that force us to redefine ourselves in order to continue along our chosen maze.
This is great unless we bump into other realities that force us to re-anaesthetize ourselves in order to continue along our chosen path.
...and 61 other possibilities, perhaps the best of which is:

This is terrible until we bump into other assumptions that force us to re-anaesthetize ourselves in order to continue along our chosen maze.

...wait, what was "this" again?
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Old 12-30-2009, 01:54 PM   #4
Aikibu
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Re: Dilemma

A dog chasing it's own tail never bumps into anything.

William Hazen
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Old 12-30-2009, 01:59 PM   #5
Alec Corper
 
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Re: Dilemma

Hey, come on guys, you're not taking this seriously enough. Pretty soon the thread will be moved....... somewhere else!

If your temper rises withdraw your hand, if your hand rises withdraw your temper.
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Old 12-30-2009, 02:00 PM   #6
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Re: Dilemma

I understand/don't understand and agree/disagree with/without you.

David/Not David
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Old 12-30-2009, 02:03 PM   #7
Maarten De Queecker
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote: View Post
I understand/don't understand and agree/disagree with/without you.

David/Not David
Seems like you have an existential problem!
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Old 12-30-2009, 02:19 PM   #8
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Alec Corper wrote: View Post
Hey, come on guys, you're not taking this seriously enough. Pretty soon the thread will be moved....... somewhere else!
Is the dilemma "to post or not to post...and why?" ...Or am I just seeing my own reflection there?

Gambarimashyo!
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Old 12-30-2009, 03:07 PM   #9
Alec Corper
 
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Re: Dilemma

These are some of the most "aiki" comments I've seen for a long time, such blending, perfect tenkan, just a touch of avoidance/evasion and great sen. Even my fingertips are feeling martial now.

If your temper rises withdraw your hand, if your hand rises withdraw your temper.
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Old 12-30-2009, 03:11 PM   #10
Alec Corper
 
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Re: Dilemma

BTW, the "this" someone asked about is that everybody is doing their own aikido, whatever that is, and whether we agree or diagree with that fact is a fart in the wind.;-)

If your temper rises withdraw your hand, if your hand rises withdraw your temper.
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Old 12-30-2009, 03:16 PM   #11
Janet Rosen
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Alec Corper wrote: View Post
BTW, the "this" someone asked about is that everybody is doing their own aikido
Oh I don't know, sometimes I feel like I'm stuck doing somebody else's (surely MINE couldn't be this bad), and I'd like to know where and how to exchange it for one of better quality.

Janet Rosen
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"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
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Old 12-30-2009, 03:19 PM   #12
eyrie
 
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Re: Dilemma

Dilemma? What dilemma? The teacher/instructor (or anyone who sets themselves up as such/advertises the fact that they are in a position to do so) has an obligation to teach the student - irrespective of where they are at in their own development, or how they define what it is they supposedly do/teach at whatever point in time. IOW, if one has "students", one has implicitly accepted the responsibility of guiding that student. And therefore, it is the teacher's responsibility to ensure that the student receives what they require to learn - at the student's level of development. Even if it something that the student must figure out for themselves, the teacher must provide the pre-requisite learning environment in order for the student to discover for themselves.

Likewise, the student (by definition), implicitly accepts the obligation to learn and attempt to replicate what the teacher presents. To borrow a classroom analogy, if you turn up to a MA101 lecture expecting to do SD211, then you're in the wrong class... MA101 is in the great hall on the other side of the campus.

By the same token, a student may have several teachers, just as a university student may choose to do various units and electives in their chosen course of study. Over the course of my undergrad years, I had several lecturers, each teaching in their distinct areas of specialization. It was up to me as an undergrad to reconcile several discrete bodies of knowledge, and work out how these separate and distinct subjects could be applied to future career choices.

If you look at the career paths of many of the past and present teachers, they would have had several teachers and people they collaborated with over the course of their careers. They too would have studied with, and learnt from a variety of sources, formally or otherwise. It would be unrealistic to expect that such a person exists that was the embodiment of all there is to know. Or that one is expected to learn all there is to learn from only that person, and no other.

Ignatius
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Old 12-30-2009, 03:37 PM   #13
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Alec Corper wrote: View Post
These are some of the most "aiki" comments I've seen for a long time, such blending, perfect tenkan, just a touch of avoidance/evasion and great sen. Even my fingertips are feeling martial now.
Is that a "no" to my first question then?

Gambarimashyo!
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Old 12-30-2009, 07:20 PM   #14
lbb
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Alec Corper wrote: View Post
These are some of the most "aiki" comments I've seen for a long time, such blending, perfect tenkan, just a touch of avoidance/evasion and great sen. Even my fingertips are feeling martial now.
After a brisk walk in 10 degree weather (that's 10 Fahrenheit, you metric peoples) and half a bottle of sauvignon blanc, my fingertips aren't feeling anything.
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Old 12-30-2009, 07:23 PM   #15
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
After a brisk walk in 10 degree weather (that's 10 Fahrenheit, you metric peoples) and half a bottle of sauvignon blanc, my fingertips aren't feeling anything.
Nothin wrong wid dat!

I hope you at least had a good dog with you...
B,
R

Ron Tisdale
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"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
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Old 12-31-2009, 07:58 AM   #16
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
After a brisk walk in 10 degree weather (that's 10 Fahrenheit, you metric peoples) and half a bottle of sauvignon blanc, my fingertips aren't feeling anything.
Oh that is just great Mary! So apparently you are culturally insensitive to those that use the Kelvin Scale! You know not everything can and should be measured by Centrgade or Fahrenheit Scales!

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Old 12-31-2009, 08:02 AM   #17
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Dilemma

Alec wrote:

Quote:
Shihans don't want to define Aikido (could be health system, Budo, self development, self defense, art form, shugyo, etc., etc.) nobody knows what the hell they are doing, except insofar as they define it for themselves and their way of practicing their image of aikido fits in the dojo they are part of, or at least, for the time being. This is great/terrible unless/until we bump into other realities/assumptions that force/persuade us to redefine/re-anesthetize ourselves in order to continue along our chosen path/maze
Maybe it has been left loosely defined to allow us the room to bump into the reality. To give us a platform and space to make our own, to ask questions, to....gasp!...internalize for ourselves.

Maybe there is nothing wrong with things following the same basic tennants, yet being different.

Maybe it is the differences we are supposed to notice, embrace, and celebrate.

Maybe the abolishment of fundamentalism and fundamentalist thinking is a big part of the process.

I don't know, but it sure has been a great ride so far for me!

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Old 12-31-2009, 08:07 AM   #18
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Re: Dilemma

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Old 12-31-2009, 01:32 PM   #19
Walter Martindale
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Kevin Leavitt wrote: View Post
Oh that is just great Mary! So apparently you are culturally insensitive to those that use the Kelvin Scale! You know not everything can and should be measured by Centrgade or Fahrenheit Scales!
Well, Hang on... The Kelvin and Celsius (Centigrade) scales have the same graduations.. Different "zero" points... No minus K temperatures....

Let's see... 10 F (10-32)x5/9-32= -12.2C
Ok, that's starting to get cool...

Happy New Year everyone.
W
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Old 12-31-2009, 01:43 PM   #20
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Dilemma

Quote:
Kevin Leavitt wrote: View Post
Maybe it has been left loosely defined to allow us the room to bump into the reality. To give us a platform and space to make our own, to ask questions, to....gasp!...internalize for ourselves.

Maybe there is nothing wrong with things following the same basic tennants, yet being different.

Maybe it is the differences we are supposed to notice, embrace, and celebrate.

Maybe the abolishment of fundamentalism and fundamentalist thinking is a big part of the process.

I don't know, but it sure has been a great ride so far for me!
I really like that Kevin! Beautifully put! Thank you.
Happy New Year!

Gambarimashyo!
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