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Old 08-19-2009, 08:28 PM   #151
Buck
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Re: True Internal Strength

In my last post I pointed out that the term and its use of "internal strength" was used by a person in yoga. I also touched on how that is similar for me in Aikido and how I use the term.

It is pretty clear the term "internal strength" isn't a solely a translated Chinese martial arts phrase, but rather universal where different meaning can be attached be depending to whom you are speaking. In my use and the use of the article about "internal strength is about focusing on yourself, and that leads to many things such as self-evaluation. Which in turn also can lead a person to evaluate themselves. The result can be a better character. Possibly, for example, in my case where I sought revenge prior to Aikido and as a result of Aikido changed my mind. True internal strength is a very power thing.

True internal strength some each person experiences differently and uniquely. Some people get it, some people don't. That is an individual thing. Being an individual thing does it enhance an individual's skill. I don't think, so but there are exceptions to every rule. Does it effect a person's personality. Yes, it can. It did me, and others I know. But, certainly we can tell those who have it and those who don't.

Doesn't it matter if people get develop true internal strength. I don't think so. I think it would be a better world if they did. People would be more disciplined in thought, words, and actions if they did.

It's one thing to have all the skill in the world and be a real jerk either on the net and not in person. It is another to not save such great skill and have great true internal strength (like some I know) and not a jerk. It would be ideal to have great skill equally true internal strength. We don't live in a ideal world, people chase (values) what glitters and shines that sadly blinds them from a truth(s).

What am saying is that true internal strength draws our focus inward, where self evaluation and others such things occur for the betterment of the self. In my case that is what happen, because of true internal strength that happened through the practice of Aikido. I re-adjusted my attitude, and seen revenge as not an effective way to go.

Now, currently, I see through true internal strength from practicing Aikido, the huge role of a certain type of ego seen in martial arts, as it often reflect great insecurities, lack of self confidence, and stuff like that.

Point is Aikido is a great journey because it isn't just about how well you throw someone, or what you can do something, or what ever on or off the mat. That is important to some more than others, and that is O.K. But, skill isn't all of what can be gained/learned from Aikido. And I have pointed out one thing, it being true internal strength that leads to many positive things, at least for me.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 08:43 PM   #152
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Re: True Internal Strength

Now that I have come to the end of my discussion on true internal strength something that I felt has great benefits to me, and hopefully for others. I feel fortunate to be able to have this discussion and have it here on Aikiweb. Lastly, I would like to thank Rob for his comment that I used to spark this topic and opportunity.

Last edited by Buck : 08-19-2009 at 08:46 PM.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 08:49 PM   #153
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Re: True Internal Strength

I just read something great about Aikido that I think is really great and relates to my post #151. I really like how this is said. "I really miss having participated [Aikido class]! In a sort of visceral "missing someone" sense. I've felt kind of off-balance since then."

"Interesting how much Aikido becomes part of us (and how quickly)."
http://www.aikiweb.com/blogs/my-path...-missing-3593/

Beautifully said!

Last edited by Buck : 08-19-2009 at 08:52 PM.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 10:16 PM   #154
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
Oh. I thought maybe he meant when you're out at a bar and a friend comes up short and needs to borrow money from you. Thanks for clarifying.
I think he did mean Lent... which is "pagan" in origin - c/f Babylonian/early Mesopotamian, in which a quadrigesimal (40-day) period of fasting was preceded by a festival of wild debauchery. The period of "fasting" (due largely to the fact that winter stores have now been depleted and food is scarce), lasts from late-winter solstice/early-spring equinox, was supposedly held in honour of the Goddess of Fertility and heralds the start of next cycle.

And then we have Easter and Christmas, which are also both pagan in origin. Note "pagan" (or heathen), is used in this context to derogatorily refer to "uncivilized country folk", who still practiced polytheism, and which had not yet been - i.e. refused to - converted to Catholicism.

I see the 40-hour famine is back on here.... hmmm.... the timing is somewhat coincidental, since over here in the Antipodes, spring is nearly upon us.

But, back on point... I'm not sure what paganism, Christianity, or character development has anything to do with Aikido or True™ Internal Strength. I think Buck is making a point about understanding what it is one is "practising" - hence the pagan reference.

Or maybe he did mean lint after all... Either that, or I'm not following his convoluted line of argument.... I'm slow like that.

Ignatius
 
Old 08-19-2009, 10:46 PM   #155
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Ignatius Teo wrote: View Post
I think he did mean Lent... [[snip]]Or maybe he did mean lint after all... Either that, or I'm not following his convoluted line of argument.... I'm slow like that.
I think we just got a bite, Mary. Ignatius... Mary Malmros is one of the champion leg-pullers of all time. No one missed the Lenten reference. Whether it was germane is another thing entirely.

Mike
 
Old 08-20-2009, 12:23 AM   #156
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Re: True Internal Strength

Like I's sed... I is kinda slow like that....

OR mehbee, jus mehbee, I's talkin at dem heathen pagans....

Ignatius
 
Old 08-20-2009, 12:37 AM   #157
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Re: True Internal Strength

If Buck can't do it, can anybody offer a reply to my question?

Can true internal strength give me the ability to fight the urge to nampa gyarus hanging around Shibuya 109?
 
Old 08-20-2009, 12:45 AM   #158
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Lorel Latorilla wrote: View Post
If Buck can't do it, can anybody offer a reply to my question?

Can true internal strength give me the ability to fight the urge to nampa gyarus hanging around Shibuya 109?
http://nubreednampa.blogspot.com/200...a-nubreed.html
 
Old 08-20-2009, 12:59 AM   #159
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Re: True Internal Strength

Funny Ricky I was just looking at that website too....it is funny as all get out!

 
Old 08-20-2009, 01:06 AM   #160
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Re: True Internal Strength

Here is something I think puts a good cap on True Internal Strength.

BTW, I wasn't the first to coin the term.
 
Old 08-20-2009, 01:08 AM   #161
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Lorel Latorilla wrote: View Post
Can true internal strength give me the ability to fight the urge to nampa gyarus hanging around Shibuya 109?
Dang it boy... why would you want to fight the urge - at YOUR age??? (Or for that matter... at ANY age?)

OTOH, you might need True™ Internal Strength® to fight off the nampa competition and other c**kbl**kers.

Ignatius
 
Old 08-20-2009, 01:09 AM   #162
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Re: True Internal Strength

The response by Kevin to Lynn writing on True Internal Strength. The link is worth a looksee (same link as above).

Quote:
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Thank you for your perspective Lynn! I think you have focused wonderfully on what is the core of why we need to practice Budo, and what we get out of it.

I like you concepts of internal and external. I agree, they are more a state of mind and perspective than anything else. The concepts of internal and external may manifest themselves physically, but they begin with a single point of thought.

As has been proven throughout history and time, battles, wars, and conflict start way before the actual physical (external) manifestation of violence begins.

To me this is what being internal is all about. the realization and mindfulness that the thoughts we think, the values we live, and the choices we make....all impact the world around us!

Thanks again!
"To me this is what being internal is all about. the realization and mindfulness that the thoughts we think, the values we live, and the choices we make....all impact the world around us!"

I hear ya Bra, it is exactly the same general idea I was getting across with the yoga article, and in my last comments on True Internal Strength. Hallelujah!... Kevin... Hallelujah!

Last edited by Buck : 08-20-2009 at 01:17 AM.
 
Old 08-20-2009, 01:11 AM   #163
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Philip Burgess wrote: View Post
Inner Strength, INNER strength.... God give me strength... or a whisky please...

Last edited by eyrie : 08-20-2009 at 01:16 AM.

Ignatius
 
Old 08-20-2009, 08:05 AM   #164
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
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OTOH, maybe you don't mean the same thing, as Lynn writes:

"IMHO, true internal strength, is not pushing people away, but getting them to invite and welcome you into their practice and lives."

As an occasion to apply that maxim, and illustrate your own "TIS," how would you rate your own relative success, or lack thereof, in this thread?

I also notice, relative to the prior discussion on "rhetorical devices," that Lynn deftly "invite[s the reader] in," by acknowledging the value of the discussion about IS as normally understood. And, characteristically, ends with an exhortation to get back to training.

I love the smell of irony in the morning...smells like...well, irony.
 
Old 08-20-2009, 08:09 AM   #165
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
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Now that I have come to the end of my discussion on true internal strength
Buck, you're as reliable as the B line.
 
Old 08-20-2009, 10:13 AM   #166
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
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maybe you don't mean the same thing, as Lynn writes:
David brought up a good question. I think this is a good question (in the quote) because it maybe something many might be wondering.

What Lynn wrote about True Internal Strength explores a deeper and more dynamic stuff relating to Aikido. The author on Yoga Internal Strength explores another area that shares some of the same things related to True Internal Strength. And the benefits both authors highlight. And that is what is wonderful about True Internal Strength, it is so vast, so dynamic, so powerful and stuff.

I hope by understanding True Internal Strength better it will be recognized and practiced by those who may have not been aware of it and stuff before, and benefit them and their lives. That is the real measure of success!

Last edited by Buck : 08-20-2009 at 10:23 AM.
 
Old 08-20-2009, 10:53 AM   #167
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Re: True Internal Strength

So what's the answer to my questions -- the good one or the bad one?

Here's another, is it consistent with TIS, in your view, to avoid difficult questions raised by your own statements on a public forum, addressing instead only the ones that can be bent to your own purposes?

Regards,

cdh
 
Old 08-20-2009, 11:05 AM   #168
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Re: True Internal Strength

In the context I was responding to Lynn it is essentially "Mind leads the body".

If you go back and read closely what most internal guys talk bout, believe Dan Harden talks a great deal about this concerning intent.

However, there is a distinction between "mind leads the body" and "mind leads the mind".

Mind leads the body means that you command your body to action and that is what we are trying to refine and improve.

Mind leading the mind is mental masturbation and leads to nothing in budo but a bunch of digits and good conversation in a Starbucks.

 
Old 08-20-2009, 11:41 PM   #169
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Kevin Leavitt wrote: View Post
a distinction between "mind leads the body" and "mind leads the mind".
have you ever heard the phrase 'slave to the mind'?
 
Old 08-20-2009, 11:58 PM   #170
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Re: True Internal Strength

I believe so Josh, in what context though? as ego?

 
Old 08-21-2009, 12:05 AM   #171
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Re: True Internal Strength

what did you make of it, Kevin? have you thought about it?
i'm not sure if i cna put a ;context; on it. like all of perception of reality. the camera thru which you view life passing before your eyes. in that way. and how you experience your own brain. and thoughts. and such.
 
Old 08-21-2009, 12:30 AM   #172
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Lorel Latorilla wrote: View Post
If Buck can't do it, can anybody offer a reply to my question?

Can true internal strength give me the ability to fight the urge to nampa gyarus hanging around Shibuya 109?
No. Not that alone.
Lorel, buddy, the only think i can think of for you (and i don't know you but through your earnest sounding request onlin3) is that perhaps you release some of your inner essence by using some outer strength so that your internal strength can dominate your inner weakness so you can get back to training internal strength. do it all well my brother.
cheers,
josh
 
Old 08-21-2009, 12:55 AM   #173
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Josh, heck I don't know. What is important I think is to recognize that we are all products of our own experiences. To manage the information and knowledge we take in, we have to make tradeoffs and act accordingly to what we feel is right. Many times we let our emotional centers lead. Many times it is the rational/logic centers. Sometimes it is the instinctual/intuitive part as well. Heck, I am not a brain expert!

Take the Healthcare debate...what do you make of how folks are responding? Are they taking the time to process the information themselves, study it, ask deep probing questions, or are many people acting on the opinions and emotions of others? It is very scarey if you ask me!

Back to budo though.

I think we need to be constantly aware that we are prone to form our own perceptions of reality and we form responses. Sometimes the responses that we form feel right, but in reality they may not be right.

I tell you, learning about the Alexander Technique from Paulinna L a couple of years ago really brought this to the forefront to me.

So, recoginizing that the mind leads the body...and that many times, the mind is not correct...we need to work hard to expose ourselves to other options and methods as much as we can I think and work with others to guide us, so we can expand our ability to see and experience options and perspectives.

I think this is how we improve, and is more along the lines of what I would call "Internal Strength".....than simply Self Realizing and Feeling good about our practice...or Strengthening our Character.

We can Self Actualize or Realize...feel good about ourselves, feel like we have Strong Values and Strong Character...that is all fine and all that....until something comes along to challenge it...something that we never understood or considered, and it can rock our world and cause us to experience Dissonance, which leads us to no longer trust ourselves or our mind, or we make inappropriate actions because we have no clue what to do!

Is this along the lines of what you are talking about?

 
Old 08-21-2009, 01:23 AM   #174
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Quote:
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Take the Healthcare debate...wwhat do you make of how folks are responding?
weeellllllllll.....I'm afraid this may create an irrecoverable thread drift ....and i don't know that it'll survive. oh well.
i'll respond to this; and then i'm blearilyoff to bed. (did you get sagawa's book? dang interesting).

honestly; here are some stream-of-consciousness responses.
-sheeple
-why is this still a fn issue?
-why each election are the same fn issues brought up?
-you know why a scientist or engineer would be bad to be in charge of this stuff? because they would just look at it like a problem; assess options/solutions and pick the best one; and everyone could go home. -- but people and the system just don't do that.
-what do you think Kevin, I haven't been following it too closely; but what i do see is scary. it's a commin'. dammit. I don't like it one bit.
-more just gets crazier from here; and i'm waay tired.

Quote:
cause us to experience Dissonance
indeed. understood. experiencing reality is quit disturbing in some ways. in some ways being in an airplane should be terrifying. in some ways flying through space at 380,000 km/h through outer space on a big rock would be. indeed.

Can you tell me about some of the principles or lessons you took away from Alexander Technique? Is it mostly about posture, and mindfullness?

Quote:
which leads us to no longer trust ourselves or our mind, or we make inappropriate actions because we have no clue what to do!
that is interesting. i read a bruce lee quote: something like; 'why should you be anxious? look at me; I have the most insecure job on the planet; and i'm not nervous. because I know i'm gonna make it.' (loosely quoted
It seems to me that a part of martial arts is to pursue a mindset where above all else you believe in yourself. is that right? I remember I heard that in the gym at Westpoint is the slogan "Fatigue makes cowards of all men". Not sure if I got that right. .. but i was thinking about that. Everyone has an end to their rope. At some point the ultimate-fudoshin-unwavering-mind-faith in your own self would falter, wouldn't it? Making some..'inapproprate action' at some point.
(afterthought: meaning you'd abandon yourself. But if aiki is based on the thing that holds the body together, then that is the first and last thing with you (bodily)... then it is a a way to hold together after fatigue.) dunno..just thinking out loud.

can you say more about what you meant in the last para?

Quote:
Is this along the lines of what you are talking about?
not at all, but it was interesting anyway ;^)

take it easy.
goodnight and goodluck.

oh yeah;
.. 'slave to the mind'. what does that mean to you?

Last edited by thisisnotreal : 08-21-2009 at 01:36 AM.
 
Old 08-21-2009, 07:45 AM   #175
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Re: True Internal Strength

Quote:
Can you tell me about some of the principles or lessons you took away from Alexander Technique? Is it mostly about posture, and mindfullness?
I am not really qualified to discuss in detail AT. I would recommend doing some web searches or read a book about it. One of the main points of AT is that the mind leads the body, or every movement begins with a thought. This is an important concept to understand and the very basic level of study of what we do I believe if we are going to change our responses to what we want to do in aikido.

It is hard to do I believe as we have patterns of movement, feeling, and perceptions that respond in a way that we have learned and we may be approaching the re-learning/re-programming process the wrong way since most of us are never really trained how to learn except through memorization of facts or trial and error.

Worth reading about AT stuff if you are really interested in the learning aiki...a big "AH HAH" should go off once you start seeing some of the methodologies we use in aikido and what guys like Mike Sigman, Ark, and Dan are using.

Quote:
"Fatigue makes cowards of all men". Not sure if I got that right. .. but i was thinking about that. Everyone has an end to their rope. At some point the ultimate-fudoshin-unwavering-mind-faith in your own self would falter, wouldn't it? Making some..'inapproprate action' at some point.
(afterthought: meaning you'd abandon yourself. But if aiki is based on the thing that holds the body together, then that is the first and last thing with you (bodily)... then it is a a way to hold together after fatigue.) dunno..just thinking out loud.
Hmmm, not sure I completely understand where you are going with this, but.....

Breaking points....

Army sent me to a wonderful school about 13 years ago called Ranger School. Pretty much it's sole purpose was to spend 3 months working me at the edge of my physical and mental capabilities. (There are a few others that have similar training on the list as well through SEAL, Ranger, SF, maybe they will offer their comments as well).

I learned alot about myself. One that the mind is very strong and it can overcome the physical body. I was willing to let go and kill myself rather than give up mentally. So, I have that going for me.

I think there is some truth to your quote above, given situations, I mean, there are things I make my mind up about that I frankly don't want to spend anymore energy on cause it seems too difficult to do....at one level....sure. What I try and recognize is that it is a conscious decsion that I MADE! to stop and quit....not what someone else did to me, or there was no way I could succeed...I MADE the choice.

Really drove this home in Ranger School which is why I learned that I have the capacity to not quit. You see mentally weak individuals leave the program, like 80% of those who start. Most make excuses after the fact about how unfair the program was, "He didn't like me". "I got hurt and injured". Rarely do you hear, It was hard and I couldn't cut it.

It is not about being macho...it is about internal fortitude...it is a mental thing 100%. So, when you look at it that way...Fatique or Fear makes cowards out of men. Weak men that are not honest with themselves. They were cowards to begin with, they just didn't know it! They only needed an excuse.

I think we see alot of this in Aikido. Folks looking for the magic pill, meaning that is not there, faith in a sensei...or any number of reasons to not do what they need to do in Budo in order to really learn it. It is hard to train and put faith into something and maybe possibly not succeed. If we adopt the sheep mentality and look for ways to absolve ourselves of responsibility, there are a multitude of attachment points that are all too present and willing to present themselves to us and either placate us into believe we have really accomplished something through affinity..that is getting up, putting on a hakama and bowing, or we can scream, my sensei was a farce and did not teach me the hidden meanings in aikido! or we can chase the latest "GURU" out there and say "Hope is around the corner!"

What ever angle you want to pick.

Anyway, another good thing to read is Vicktor Frankl (sic). about his experiences in a Nazi Concentration camp.

It is important to learn how our mind works for us!

 

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