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Old 05-30-2009, 08:02 PM   #1401
Suru
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Doshu or a shihan versus Mike Tyson? We'll never find out.

Doshu or a shihan versus Macaulay (sp?) Culkin? Obvious.

Doshu or a shihan not fighting? Automatic victory.

Drew
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Old 05-30-2009, 09:17 PM   #1402
brUNO
 
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Matthew Gano wrote: View Post
Presumption is the mother of all...something...
It's "Assumption" is the mother of all screw ups (Replaced the "F"word) I assumed I wouldn't get a single reply to this thread, guess I screwed up?!
Quote:
Sometimes the sucker is aware he/she is being played and is simply enjoying the game themselves...for what it's worth.
I'm enjoying it, I thought it was funny! Espesially the thread title. Its really hard to ignore, isn't it? I sure couldn't. Its like a train wreck, Choo-choo! Well, welcome to the dance, Ladies & Gentlemen.

I'll see you in more serious dicussions later on, I'm sure. Don't judge me by first post, I came to randori.
Onegaisumasu.

Bruno
"A warrior is not about perfection or victory or invulnerability. He's about absolute vulnerability."
- Socrates
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Old 05-30-2009, 10:11 PM   #1403
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Brent Smith wrote: View Post
It's "Assumption" is the mother of all screw ups (Replaced the "F"word) I assumed I wouldn't get a single reply to this thread, guess I screwed up?!
Dangit! I did it again. I'm known as the Great Paraphraser (of quotes) to one friend.

Quote:
I'll see you in more serious dicussions later on, I'm sure. Don't judge me by first post, I came to randori.
Onegaisumasu.
No Worries! Read enough of my posts and even if I did judge you you probably wouldn't feel too bothered by it...I'm a little bit "in mind out of mouth" sometimes...what can I say, but life's a process!
Take care!

Gambarimashyo!
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Old 05-30-2009, 10:47 PM   #1404
hotdogwater
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Dear Brent,
Explain to me in perfect English how I tried to pick a fight with anyone on here. If I were trying to pick a fight with someone I would have been a lot more aggressive instead of practically tiptoeing through this subject so mental midgets like you wouldn't get their feelings hurt. Most of you wouldn't know irony if it fell from the sky and landed on your face. Here I am, the competitive martial artist, the military man, and I'm the one offering thought provoking statements. There you are, the traditional martial artist who is supposed to be cultured, refined and philosophical, and you're the one who is meeting me with snarky, sarcastic comments which have about as much substance as a 50 cent song. Then, to challenge me to combat, how ridiculous can you get? Do you honestly think I would actually come to your house? If you are a true aikidoka then you have already lost by challenging me to a fight. I honestly don't know how good you are because I've never heard of you. But if you were to assault me like you assault the English language then I'm sure you would probably knock me out 30 seconds into the first round.
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Old 05-31-2009, 07:25 PM   #1405
lbb
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Brent Smith
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Just sayin'...
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Old 05-31-2009, 09:49 PM   #1406
Joe McParland
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

It is quite possible that, if in fact there is a bona fide "aikido philosophy," that none of us are living up to it.

That's no big deal. It's a path, after all

Assuming that an aikido has one true philosophy to which all practitioners aspire, assuming that you understand it, assuming the practitioners are bound by it, and assuming anyone would care if he broke hypothetical rules of engagement, though - that's certainly problematic for anyone, especially a martial artist.

I do appreciate good sparing here, though... I need the practice as much as anyone

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Old 06-01-2009, 12:28 PM   #1407
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
Brent Smith
Username: brUNO
Dojo: Jita Kyoei Dojo/Dallas, Texas
Location: Dallas/Texas
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 9


Just sayin'...
Sayin' ...what? I have 9 posts? That I'm from Texas? All you did was copy and post what is common knowledge. At least I filled out my profile for everyone here to read... Just sayin'...

To Joe McParland:
Me too Joe, I love to randori and test my metal! That's all I was sayin', I guess. The fact that words can easily rile a group of potential oponents is just as much a tool as Aiki waza. I like to laugh, I like to randori, I like to test myself and ...I can laugh at myself, which I do quite often. So let's have a good laugh or let's randori. either one's OK by me.

Last edited by brUNO : 06-01-2009 at 12:39 PM. Reason: additional comments

Bruno
"A warrior is not about perfection or victory or invulnerability. He's about absolute vulnerability."
- Socrates
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Old 06-01-2009, 12:30 PM   #1408
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Brent Smith wrote: View Post
Sayin' ...what?
Sayin' that it's a common pattern for people who just want to agitate feces to create a new account on a forum and then just starting right in with what they're here for.
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Old 06-01-2009, 12:48 PM   #1409
brUNO
 
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Well, I didn't generate the feces, but I guess I did take a dump on top of it that made the pile bigger. My apologies. It just amazed me to see that these types of threads were getting the most attention.

From now on, I will try to direct my energy towards more enlightening topics, thank you for your enlightenment.

Bruno
"A warrior is not about perfection or victory or invulnerability. He's about absolute vulnerability."
- Socrates
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Old 06-01-2009, 01:46 PM   #1410
lbb
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Brent Smith wrote: View Post
Well, I didn't generate the feces, but I guess I did take a dump on top of it that made the pile bigger. My apologies. It just amazed me to see that these types of threads were getting the most attention.
Eh. I think it depends on what you mean by "the most attention". In terms of number of posts, sure, for the following reasons:

1)They're unresolvable questions. You will never get consensus, much less universal agreement, and they can go on forever.

2)As they go on forever, they never die down, because as the old participants (eventually) realize "this is going nowhere" and go elsewhere, new people are always coming in, reading the first half-page of the thread, and injecting their two cents.

3)The main reason people want to inject their two cents is that the questions are button-pushers.

4)The main reason people can inject their two cents is that it doesn't take any real thought and effort to do so. Because the questions are unresolvable, many people "reason", any opinion is as good as any other opinion, and if you repeat it with lots of emoticons and italics and vague references to poorly digested concepts you've heard referred to third-hand, so much the better.

In other words, the barrier to "participate" in such a thread is low. If you want to say, therefore, that these threads get "the most attention", well, that's your interpretation. You could, on the other hand, look at some of the threads where you need to put a good bit more thought and effort in order to play. So, which thread gets "the most attention": one where ten louts engage in a "is not" "is so" "I'm more street lethaler than thou" shouting match, or one where people bring some research, experience, and quality writing to what they're posting, instead of just adolescent chest-pounding?

Quote:
Brent Smith wrote: View Post
From now on, I will try to direct my energy towards more enlightening topics, thank you for your enlightenment.
No charge, grasshopper. Try to stay out of trouble.
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Old 06-01-2009, 02:09 PM   #1411
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Ah Mary, you didn't mention the dreaded Circus Ponies Of Death (Copyright, Mary Malmos) ...

I always loved that, even back in the days on Rec.martial-arts.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
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"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 06-01-2009, 02:51 PM   #1412
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Re: A JOKE: How may Aikidoka does it take to change a Moron?

Quote:
Brent Smith wrote: View Post
So let's have a good laugh or let's randori. either one's OK by me.
Pleased to meet you, Brent

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Old 06-01-2009, 08:16 PM   #1413
lbb
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Ron Tisdale wrote: View Post
Ah Mary, you didn't mention the dreaded Circus Ponies Of Death (Copyright, Mary Malmos) ...

I always loved that, even back in the days on Rec.martial-arts.
Nuh uh, Ron! That was Lauren Radner who raised and trained the CPoD. I just borrowed them on occasion when the arguments about "But what if you were attacked by a Crack-Crazed Street Scum who happens to be Navy Seal on the day that you just broke both legs" get out of hand.
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Old 06-02-2009, 07:34 AM   #1414
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
Nuh uh, Ron! That was Lauren Radner who raised and trained the CPoD. I just borrowed them on occasion when the arguments about "But what if you were attacked by a Crack-Crazed Street Scum who happens to be Navy Seal on the day that you just broke both legs" get out of hand.
Ah man! Another Internet Myth bites the dust! Still cracks me up though. And so often appropriate...

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
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"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:08 PM   #1415
Suru
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Brent, many of your posts are for the profane world. In Aikido, the vast majority of us are searching for the divine in ourselves. I hope you'll think about this some. Don't get me wrong, I have had my moments, but overall I try to plant a tree as opposed to cutting one down. Now, sometimes a tree of what I consider falsehood, I slice with a katana, striving to do so as respectively as possible. Again, though I have had my moments too.

Drew
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:36 PM   #1416
mcrow
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Here's a newbies take on Aikido:

#1- It's the most pure defense martial art that I know of.

#2- It is reactive, so not the best style for fighting competitions.

#3- Should be highly effective against 99% of population.

I was a national level wrestler in HS as well as a 2nd degree BB in Shotokan Karate. I have some training BJJ and Boxing as well.

Just take a look at some Christian Tissier videos, that guy generates force with his tech. While you can tell some of the guys are "going with it" (for their own safety) if you watch closely some of these guys are getting utterly destroyed and are not "going with it".

So, is Aikido a sport combat MA? No. Is it a practical self defense system that will work against most people? Yes.

I have a feeling that if Mr. Tissier was faced off against some of todays top MMA fighters he'd to just fine.
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Old 04-20-2010, 01:42 AM   #1417
kyle.a.russell
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I know this thread is old but I'd just like to say that I've used Aikido to defend myself twice since I've started training. Once against a choke from behind and once against a tsuki(sp?) from a switchblade. Worked fine for me =o)
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Old 04-20-2010, 08:15 AM   #1418
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Kyle Russell wrote: View Post
I know this thread is old but
...there's nothing quite as tasty as ten year old leftover what-was-it scoured from the back reaches of the fridge, so let's have another serving of it
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Old 04-20-2010, 12:39 PM   #1419
CNYMike
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
...there's nothing quite as tasty as ten year old leftover what-was-it scoured from the back reaches of the fridge, so let's have another serving of it
Yeah, is the guy who started this even still training, much less following this thread?

That said, my Kali instructor is fond of saying that any technique that saves your bacon is the best technique in the universe. So if a bunch of Monday Morning Internet Quaterbacks pontificate about how X shouldn't work, and someone comes along and says X worked, who am I to argue with that experience?

Now, if you'll excuse me, I think I have to mainline some Pepto.

"I am not a big fat panda. I am the big fat panda." --Po, Kung Fu Panda
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Old 04-20-2010, 01:41 PM   #1420
C. David Henderson
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Ron Tisdale wrote: View Post
I'm sure it will be going strong five years from now...
4.01.05

Ron, I knew you were a genius, but prescient too?

David Henderson
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Old 04-20-2010, 07:40 PM   #1421
RED
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

There are like 5million threads around the basements of this site asking this same tired question. It is sort of a boring this to discuss at this point and a really tired topic for me.

MM
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Old 04-22-2010, 07:13 PM   #1422
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I am surprised at seeing still alive a thread that was originated... ten years ago.

Have we a reason for it?
Probably.

As an utter beginner, I hold a disadvantage and an advantage: the former being that I have no authority to speak, the latter being that I may still have a mindset fit to understand beginners placing myself so easily to their level, being it the level where I belong.

So, is Aikido effective in a real fight?
Define real fight first.

Here is my definition: whenever an opponent is determined to inflict injuries to you regardless of whether they may be fatal or not, that is a fight.
We refine it: this opponent is not totally naive as far as fighting is concerned.

So, you're in for a regular beating.
Now: is Aikido effective in this context?

The answer is: aikidokas are not.
I have seen several black belts so utterly unable to do even the most basic techniques, that one wonders whether they ever realized or not that spending 5 or 6 years on that tatami was totally pointless for them: facing a determined opponent, they would be facing diresome and sudden damage without even seeing it coming.
I have also seen a few excellent ones: rarities, true gems.

However, to be honest: this is what happens also to the vast majority of persons that practice whatever self defense method or work out: they are all mediocre to say the best.

Why this happens?
Lack of fight.

In the mythical old times, you started fighting at dawn and you finished at dusk.
Now, why people did that? Because they badly needed to fight?
If so, why? The chances an average person has to be in a real fight are minimal, maybe once in 5 or even 10 years.
So why some persons closed themselves up in a martial art monastery and started such an endless trail of pains?

They did not seek the fight: they were after something else, that could reveal itself only cracking the nut.

I call it holistic proprioception. You feel the presence: you feel yourself, every edge, within whatever dynamic environment, and you feel your opponent as if you have become one with him/her.

Eventually, the ideogram behind this all is to fight blidfolded. If one could ever attain that ideal threshold, no doubt you have truly found something - but it becomes then patent and obvious that this something was not something pursued for the sake of beating guys up - if that were the objective, a gun is infinitely more practical and to the point for that purpose.
You have attained something that is unvaluable, and it is such well beyond the scope of fighting - it is one step away from satori, from enlightenment.

In this regard, Aikido is still true to that old goal: being able to feel the presence and the flux so much that you might fight blindfolded.

Doging a boxer that edges in and out of your range quickly is something that is within the capabilities of aikido - as well as reaching his side via irime or tenkan and apply an ikkyo going with the flow.

Why then so few may do that?
Because in our gyms there is no real combat. Pupils are placed within totally fictional settings, which if at first are aptly disguised as theorically needed to safeguard the newcomers (invariably assumed as being made of glass, so much that the more experienced guys could make to them untold of damage if they are not carefully tended as callow puppies) from "potential harm", actually become a regular habit pretty soon: an habit that one is any longer able to shrug off. The real combat you are allegedly being prepared for never comes. The fiction goes on. And everybody eventually becomes complacent with the fiction. It becomes the expected standard, defying which places you immediately on the level of the incomprehensible outsider that is spoling the play.

Uke is complacent.
Ukes that are not complacent are being told "hey I am learning, follow me" (follow me? In Aikido? Oh, they truly got it uh! lol).
Ukes that are not complacent are bound to be complacent with beginners though. So they start diseducating them, without having this intention. They educate them to get killed.
Eventually, Ukes that are not complacent give up and tired of being considered troublemakers, resign and are compensated by becoming just another grey belt. A very happy one, though.

The reason Aikido is not effective is the same one so many other fighting schools teach guys how to cultivate an extremely dangerous feeling of security that is not there.
And the reason is: they never fight. They imitate fights, and in the name of avoiding potential harm in the gym, we make sure we can have it in real life.

I am glad to see here randori mentioned.
In fact, even if ukes were complacent, a randori setting is still one that forces a pupil to live aikido with at least something that is not fictional: the necessity to react quickly and in a creative (and not previously prescribed or expected) way.

If you stand a chance to win a fight with aikido, you can find it with randori only. You must find your way of moving within the mess, your own way of going with the tide, your own approach to dodging and reacting. Eventually, far more important that technical perfection in a technique is that a pupil gets a chance to find his/her way of moving inside a messy situation. Teach tmem all the techniques of the world but no randori, and they will experience sudden inujuries or death in a real fight; teach them no techniques but get them used to move amidts attackers, and you have lent them a better favour.
Do both, and you may stand a chance of seeing a few more aikidokas manage themselves pretty well once facing a real attack.

All the rest may well be only the preparation for your coffin.
No randori, no aikido.
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Old 04-22-2010, 07:44 PM   #1423
Ketsan
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Zombie thread.

If you can't use Aikido in a fight I really do question your intelligence. I mean first off you develop an immovable posture, if you can't find a use for that in a fight I question your intelligence. Second your trained to get into a clinch ASAP, combined with an immovable posture....................
Third you're trained in various ways of unbalancing an opponent combined with an immovble posture and numerous ways of getting into various types of clinch.................
Fourth you're trained to develop massive power from a relaxed body combined with an immovable posture, numerous ways of getting into various types of clinch and various ways of unbalancing an opponent.............

This isn't difficult.
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Old 04-22-2010, 08:00 PM   #1424
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I thought about responding to this thread...if I do...I think it would be b best to go back and quote myself from previous post in this thread, it would save time and I probably couldn't think of anything new to say anyway! lol!

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Old 04-22-2010, 11:03 PM   #1425
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I would like to post on one of these threads for real. This thread is clearly a joke now. But I would like to discuss the usefulness of Aikido techniques in a real thread.

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