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Old 04-11-2008, 07:17 AM   #26
Michael Douglas
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Re: fear of ukemi

Quote:
Mark Manchini wrote: View Post
... I am 255 pounds but I move like a cat to be honest.
Move like a cat to the doctor like everyone is advising.
Next thing you could do is answer the questions people in this thread have been asking. There aren't many, should be easy.
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:01 AM   #27
phitruong
Dojo: Charlotte Aikikai Agatsu Dojo
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,758
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Re: fear of ukemi

yup, see a doctor, possibly a chiropractor. gave yourself some R&R. you can still attend class and watch from the sideline (a different sort of practice - observation practice). or if you do practice, then just walk out from the technique instead of taking the roll to give your body time to heal, but still be able to practice.

Give great consideration toward Ellis Amdur approaches to ukemi. Worked great for me. we called it "monkemi" (monkey ukemi). Wiped out on my motorcycle last year, the monkemi saved your truly. only issue was my judo reflex swing my arm out for the slap. very bad idea. hands hurt for months, even when I had heavy leather padded gloves on. listen to Amdur about slapping your hands, very very good advice.

Talked to Donovan Waite about ukemi at one of the seminar. he said he no longer advocate the roll over the shoulder like most aikido folks. his forward roll looked like his body goes sideway roll. he also said the purpose of ukemi is to slow your body and dissipate the energy. too many folks tend to throw themselves at the mat. lower your body as far as you can toward the ground before doing the roll.

between Waite and Amdur sensei, they both mentioned that folks tend to roll like wheel instead of ball. Ball is better than wheel; ball can change direction quickly, wheel can't. Ball works great, at least for me.

Took ukemi for Mary Heiny sensei at one seminar and she said I did not come out of the forward ukemi fast enough to come back and attack her. she said there is a way to come out of the forward ukemi very fast, but she could not show me, because of her hips problem. anyone who studied with her that might know about this and can show it in a video of some sort, I'd be eternally grateful. couldn't think of a way to come out fast other than a forward flip with a half pike and 3/4 twist (and served with a piece of lemon).
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:59 AM   #28
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
Location: Phila. Pa
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Re: fear of ukemi

Hiyaku ukemi, one leg straight, one leg bent, (but you tend to slap on this one, unless really good), and bent leg pushes into the straight leg. You come right up and body change / forward pivot to face nage immediately.

One enterprising nage thought to rush me during such a breakfall. Boy, did he get a surprise!

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:49 AM   #29
phitruong
Dojo: Charlotte Aikikai Agatsu Dojo
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Re: fear of ukemi

Quote:
Ron Tisdale wrote: View Post
Hiyaku ukemi, one leg straight, one leg bent, (but you tend to slap on this one, unless really good), and bent leg pushes into the straight leg. You come right up and body change / forward pivot to face nage immediately.

Best,
Ron
Would crossing your legs like that put you into a position of not be able to propagate the species? and help you join the choir soprano section?
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Old 04-11-2008, 10:04 AM   #30
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
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Re: fear of ukemi

I never **cross** my legs in this fall. Jun has some clips somewhere of the fall I'm referring to.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 04-11-2008, 10:39 PM   #31
xuzen
 
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Re: fear of ukemi

"Ukemi does not hurt, it is only the landing part"

When landing, make sure you contact with maximum part of your body. In jujutsu type of breakfall, you want to land flatly along the side of your body, making contact with the major muscle part.

If you feel shoulder hurting, you most likely has banged it against the mat. If not, the most likely you have injured your shoulder from somewhere else.

If you have fear or lack of confidence, do ukemi using a crash mat to build confidence in a safe manner.

Remember, the contact during landing is at the side of your body. Click on the link for illustration, see under yoko-ukemi and yoko zempo ukemi.

Boon

Last edited by xuzen : 04-11-2008 at 10:40 PM. Reason: Erratum

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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Old 04-12-2008, 06:04 AM   #32
dps
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Re: fear of ukemi

Soft Ukemi:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kItc4PJtCa4

David
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Old 04-13-2008, 03:42 AM   #33
xuzen
 
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Re: fear of ukemi

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote: View Post
I learn hard way. The youtube example of soft ukemi is not practical when tori load you up on his hip and throw you over his shoulder down towards mother earth at acceleration of over 10 meters per second squared. As I said earlier... I learned the hard way.

Boon.

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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Old 04-13-2008, 09:44 PM   #34
dps
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Re: fear of ukemi

Quote:
Mark Manchini wrote: View Post
sup all..

for some reason(s) lately I have a fear of ukemi. over the past couple months my shoulders have been hurting me alot. almost to the point i cant even move my arms at times. no broken bones no torn tendons, just a very unusual pain in both shoulders. I think I hurt them doing ukemi. I have been taking aikido for 2 years and i consider myself very athletic. I am 255 pounds but I move like a cat to be honest. But, I have a very hard time with ukemi. sensei tells me everything looks fine most the time but to me its hurting my body. now everytime I fall I have a fear of getting hurt. my shoulders hurt so I try and get them out of the way quickly during ukemi, but when I do (this happened tonight) I end up landing flat on the smal lof my back. now I strained my back. no matter how well I do a roll I find a way to hurt my shoulders or back, sometimes I tweek my neck. its scary. I think an option is lose some weight. I would like to be down to 220 maybe less. Im working on that. mentally is there any advice you guys/gals might have for me. or even physically...i would appreciate any advice..thx
I am 53 years old and weigh 240 lbs and if I don't do ukemi right it hurts and recovery is very slow.

One thing that helps my ukemi to be smooth is the way I breathe during ukemi. I was taught to inhale quickly through the nose before the fall and then exhale out the mouth throughout the fall. This makes the ukemi smoother because you are more relaxed and with little or no air in the lungs when you hit the mat, it is easier on your body.

David

Last edited by dps : 04-13-2008 at 09:57 PM.
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Old 04-14-2008, 09:54 AM   #35
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
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Re: fear of ukemi

Just to be clear, I was not refering to the Dovovan Waite style ukemi in the video just up stream. Though there are some similarities...

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 04-14-2008, 10:30 AM   #36
dragonteeth
Dojo: Elkton Ki-Aikido
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Re: fear of ukemi

Do you have a link to yours Ron?

I found Bruce Bookman's dvds to be pretty useful so far myself. It helps to have mats near or in front of the TV to play along...just make sure you aim well - putting one's foot through the screen is usually NOT covered by the warranty!
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Old 04-16-2008, 01:23 AM   #37
marky musashi
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Re: fear of ukemi

thx for all your comments. the strangest thing happened. i couldnt walk good or sit or sleep cuz of my back. i went to the dojo to drop off someone, went inside put on my gi, i figured i would stretch for 15 minutes slowly to see where my body is at. after stretching for 20 minutes an dlayin on hardwood. i popped up no pian, stepped on tatami mat and started my aikido practice for over 1 hour. ukemi and everything. mind over body type thing. i feel about 70% right now. i figured out something that was never engraved in my head about ukemi. get your slap hand down quick. i think thats how i got hurt. i wasnt gettin my slap hand down and takin the impact with my back and such. rookie mistake i guess. as far as mu shoulders go i honestly think it was a mixture of bad ukemi and my body changing. my bones and posture are changing. seems strange at age 33 to go thru major tweaks in teh body.....thx for all your thoughts..
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Old 04-16-2008, 08:09 AM   #38
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
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Re: fear of ukemi

More changes to come! Enjoy, and I'm glad you are back on the mats.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 05-06-2008, 06:53 AM   #39
Zolley
Dojo: Wimbledon, London
Location: London
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 15
United Kingdom
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Re: fear of ukemi

You may want to take a look at common ukemi mistakes and the main principles of rolls. Might not be directly against your fear but if you understand what could cause the pain, correction in technique can help overcome the fear (or some of it, at least).

There are some presentations and discussions at OnlineAikido.com about these things (you may need to contact them saying where you heard from the site or why you want access the ukemi presentation).
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Old 05-10-2008, 10:03 AM   #40
Elaine Adams
Dojo: Takehaya Dojo
Location: Rome
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Italy
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Re: fear of ukemi

Hi there,with all the existing replies I guess you will sort yourself out, but just to put my two penneth worth in....

I had trouble "daring" to do ukemi a while back. I was in a catch 22 situation, I had pulled a muscle in my shoulder through falling wrongly, and didn't want to hurt myself again, so would fall wrongly, and so it went on. I was lucky enough to have a great instructor who gave me his valuable time and took me aside to practise on crash mats. The confidence this gave me had me break falling at yellow belt. (Thanks Tony!)

Even now, although my technique isn't even approaching the approach to being even satisfactory, I get compliments at my willingness to fling me little self about!

I love break falling now, it's like flying. Shame you have to hit the mat! Good luck.
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