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Old 08-31-2007, 02:10 PM   #1
Joseph Aaron
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Ukemi worried

Having not praticed aikido before I'm and worried about rolling because I cannot do it at all (lol). Is there any advicr you can give me.

Joseph Aaron
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Old 08-31-2007, 02:34 PM   #2
grondahl
Dojo: Stockholms Aikidoklubb
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Re: Ukemi worried

Actually, you already have to be good at aikido to be allowed in to a dojo. No keiko for you! (shouted in soup-nazi-voice)

Dont worry, nobody knows how to take ukemi before they start to train. The purpose of training is to learn aikido and ukemi is a vital part of it. I have yet to see a dojo that doesn´t put a lot of effort to make sure that new members learn proper ukemi.
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Old 08-31-2007, 02:57 PM   #3
Janet Rosen
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Re: Ukemi worried

Be patient w/ yourself.
I was the kid who flunked somersaults at day camp....decades later when I took up aikido at age 41, I managed to train for at least 3 months before I TRIED a forward roll. There is a lot you can do with simply learning footwork, simple rolling back and up then progressing to back rolls (easier for many of us than forward rolls, but YMMV), especially if the dojo you are at does a lot of suwariwaza (kneeling technique) so you are really just learning to safely gently fall over at first.

Janet Rosen
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"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
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Old 08-31-2007, 09:30 PM   #4
dps
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Joseph Aaron wrote: View Post
Having not praticed aikido before I'm and worried about rolling because I cannot do it at all (lol). Is there any advicr you can give me.

Joseph Aaron
Think round. Image yourself as a round ball rolling along the floor.

David
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Old 09-01-2007, 12:55 AM   #5
tarik
 
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Joseph Aaron wrote: View Post
Having not praticed aikido before I'm and worried about rolling because I cannot do it at all (lol). Is there any advicr you can give me.
Find a good teacher; practice with attention to detail.

Regards,

Tarik Ghbeish
Jiyūshin-ryū AikiBudō - Iwae Dojo

MASAKATSU AGATSU -- "The true victory of self-mastery."
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Old 09-01-2007, 08:02 AM   #6
Joseph Aaron
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Re: Ukemi worried

Thanks guys You have really put my mind at rest although I'm a bit pevved about not even being allowed to train, peter! Boy I didm't know an aikido dojo was such an exclusive club. Do you guys have a social club? lol
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Old 09-01-2007, 08:03 AM   #7
Dewey
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Re: Ukemi worried

Don't worry about it. It comes with time & practice...like every technique. I'm relatively new to Aikido myself and I still struggle with ukemi. However, I'm getting better. Just don't rush it...be patient. The single most important thing to remember is to not take a fall unless you're comfortable with it and you have been given plenty of hands-on instruction on how to do it correctly. Contrary to what a lot of Aikido detractors claim, Aikido can be a very dangerous martial art. You can easily break any of your limbs or even your neck if you fall on them wrong.

Your profile states that you're still deciding upon a dojo. If that's still true, then be sure to shop all local dojo. Be sure to look for two things:

1) Is safety emphasized and is it observed? Does it look they're learning a technique, or does it look like they're trying to "show off" and/or hurt each other?

2) Observe the students' behaviour. Do they look like they're enjoying themselves? Do they appear to be scared of the instructor or some of the other students?

Chances are, if by observing a certain dojo and you feel uncomfortable just watching, then that's probably not the place for you to begin your training. The dojo class you observe where you just can't wait to step on the mat and join in is the place you need to be! Trust your instincts.
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Old 09-01-2007, 11:19 PM   #8
Jess McDonald
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Re: Ukemi worried

I also have a hard time with ukemi, especially the forward roll. I feel way more comfortable with back rolls or side falls.
You know what fall scares me the most- the high fall!! At my new dojo they all can do high falls; I haven't even attempted one! Should one ask to be taught how to take a high fall or you should wait to be taught it? Sorry for asking a question in your thread J. Aaron; hopefully, you we're thinking of the same thing.
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Old 09-02-2007, 04:44 PM   #9
dps
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Jess McDonald wrote: View Post
I also have a hard time with ukemi, especially the forward roll. I feel way more comfortable with back rolls or side falls.
You know what fall scares me the most- the high fall!! At my new dojo they all can do high falls; I haven't even attempted one! Should one ask to be taught how to take a high fall or you should wait to be taught it? Sorry for asking a question in your thread J. Aaron; hopefully, you we're thinking of the same thing.
Jess,
Next time you see someone do a "high fall" don't look at how high their feet are in the air, notice how close their head is to the ground.

David
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Old 09-02-2007, 06:46 PM   #10
Dewey
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Jess McDonald wrote: View Post
[cut/edit]
...Should one ask to be taught how to take a high fall or you should wait to be taught it? Sorry for asking a question in your thread J. Aaron; hopefully, you we're thinking of the same thing.
Absolutely. Never be bashful about asking. I found out the hard way. I was at a seminar where they were doing hip throws...and I wasn't comfortable yet with high falls yet. Short of it was, I really did a number on my shoulder...took a good week for it to heal. If I didn't have enough sense to sit out the rest of the seminar, I would have seriously injured myself. In the end...you know your own limits. You need to take care of you.
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Old 09-03-2007, 01:23 AM   #11
Tijani1150
 
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Re: Ukemi worried

2 main things

protect your head

&

push with the back leg

I personaly still have not perfected my ukemi since the teaching staff in my dojo always point out that my arm collapses when it shouldn't I wish I can tape my self and see where I fault.
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Old 09-15-2007, 10:20 AM   #12
Erik Jögimar
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Ahmed Altalib wrote: View Post
2 main things

protect your head

&

push with the back leg

I personaly still have not perfected my ukemi since the teaching staff in my dojo always point out that my arm collapses when it shouldn't I wish I can tape my self and see where I fault.
I have serious issues with ukemi, especially back rolls, but forward are easier. Put one hand so it points behind you, on the opposite side shoulder of the one you're rolling over. Then put the other one as support, so the fingertips meet. I cant do it one handed yet.
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Old 09-17-2007, 07:48 AM   #13
wayneth
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Re: Ukemi worried

In my opinion, ukemi is something which can only come over time. That is with practice and learning it at your own pace, rather than people trying to throw you across the mat and you can't even ukemi yet. In other words your training partner (whatever level) should always come down to you and not the other way around.
I remember reading Kisshomaru Doshus book once and in it, he stated that ukemi will take a minimum of 3 years before a basic understanding is achieved (something like that anyway?)
wayne
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Old 09-18-2007, 08:08 AM   #14
charyuop
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Re: Ukemi worried

Hi. I am failry new to Aikido (like 9 months) and yes Ukemi takes time to be learnt. I still have hard times taking forward rolls above all like following techniques like Kaiten Nage where I do not know from the beginning where I am thrown, but I am forced to follow the flowing of the movements.

When time comes to learn forward rolls you will probably start from your knees to move later on from standing position. Do not watch too many videos of Aikido where you see already expert Uke taking rolls. In a dojo Sensei or the nage throwing you will know you are a beginner and will give you time to get ready and take your fall at your pace. You will find many things that will make things hard to roll, but the main thing (for most beginners) will be fear...either you know it or not.
You have to learn to trust your body and not doubt it. Hesitation and tension will make things harder. Visualize yourself rolling and don't think about anything else. Follow the direction of your Sensei and don't think about broken neck or bad things coz they won't happen. Pain in the beginning will be normal also coz some muscles that take part to the rolling "game" need to get used to it.
One of the best suggestions that was given to me was to look where I am going. Like when you walk you just look where you go and don't think about the steps you take, so in a roll think about the final destination and put all your intent into it.

Jess, I was scared about high falls too. The idea of having to take a roll without "being a ball" where I know I have a free hand always available to put near my head if I need really terrified me.
One day Sensei was throwing me with Kotegaeshi and he started doing it faster and harder beyond the point I could take it on purpose. He suddenly stopped and told me the next kotegaeshi to turn with my center and take a high fall (giving me the details on how to do it). PANIC! But I tried anyway without esitations and didn't go that bad. I landed a little bit too much on the center of my back instead of the side, but I didn't even realize I was doing it. Sensei told me that unfortunately the best way to learn high falls is the hard way in a technique and I agree. There are exercises to learn, but doing it while keeping up with a kotegaeshi or another technique will lead you in doing it without thinking about it...not time to stop or to hesitate.
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Old 09-29-2007, 11:45 PM   #15
Stephen Webb
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Re: Ukemi worried

First of all, first post. Hi all.

Joseph,

If I recall, I didn't actually take ukemi from a live throw until my third practice. For a while nobody will throw you terribly hard, but after maybe a month or two of regular practice, a good nage will be able to throw you at the edge of your comfort level. You won't improve unless someone pushes you.

I was fortunate enough to spend the first few months at my new dojo practicing in small practices with very high-ranking people. I've been going for about a year and a half now, and I'm doing breakfalls (although admittedly poorly), and I would say that my rolling is almost like walking to me.

Just be willing to be pushed beyond comfort, and your ukemi will come along surprisingly fast.
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Old 09-30-2007, 09:15 AM   #16
Dathan Camacho
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Re: Ukemi worried

If your instructor has a very conservative approach to ukemi, i.e. he or she has you sit in seiza and put your shoulder on the mat and look behind you and then roll from seiza, then trust your instructor. They are conservative enough that you won't get hurt.

However, some very good instructors (or sempai) may let YOU judge what YOU are ready for. They may teach ukemi to the entire class and ask if you feel ready to try it. Trust your instincts. Don't let your ego prevent you from saying no if your gut is telling you that you're not up to it. 5 years from now it won't matter whether you learned a technique at 2 months or at 6 months into your aikido journey. I learned this the hard way trying to learn breakfalls before I'd really learned rolls.
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Old 10-19-2007, 10:17 PM   #17
Matthew White
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Re: Ukemi worried

First off. Everybody here has all the best wishes for you to succeed. Having said that, don't take any specific instructions from the (i.e. how to do rolls). We are not your teacher. We do not know you physical capabilities. We do not know your emotional constraints. Every instructor has their own way to teach; every style of aikido has their own way of rolling. Take instruction from your instructor. That's his responsibility.

Secondly, I'd like to restate something Mr. Dewey said. His statement was, "The single most important thing to remember is to not take a fall unless you're comfortable with it and you have been given plenty of hands-on instruction on how to do it correctly."
You should never try to "stop taking a fall". That's a good way to get hurt. When you see a technique that requires a fall you are not comfortable with, speak with your instructor and voice your concerns.
It is your instructor's job to push you beyond your comfort zone. That is something completely different from endangerment. You're going to have to understand the difference between the two, and if you don't, again, talk to the instructor about it.

Good luck, it's an amazing ride!
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Old 10-22-2007, 02:27 PM   #18
Dunken Francis
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Re: Ukemi worried

You'll be fine. Just take it easy and don't try any heroics first few weeks!!
have a look at www.youtube.com/aiki33 - slo-mo the ukemi clips and at least you'll be able to see the shape that you're after!

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Old 10-22-2007, 02:49 PM   #19
Erik Jögimar
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Re: Ukemi worried

I'm up on my second month of practicing aikido and its just now that when we've started with a couple of exercises and techniques that involve forward rolling that i feel i got a good hang of it.

Kaitennage when done really slowly, is a good way to practice
forward rolls, especially since you basically stand with your nose
on the mat. All you do is put your arm, shaped as a wheel, with blade of your hand on the mat by your side and slowly roll over.

At first it really does have a please-come-help-me feeling, but the more you do it, the more secure you get, and the more natural the rolls come. So no hurries. You'll roll like a pro in no time

Just give me your wrist!
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Old 10-22-2007, 03:13 PM   #20
Marie Noelle Fequiere
 
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Wink Re: Ukemi worried

I've been practicing for a year, and I am just beginning to feel comfortable with mae kemi. Constant practice is the simplest and best answer. I've been coming to the dojo almost every day for the past two month, including days when there is no class, and I come back late Saturday morning, after the class. I cannot believe how much I have improved. Practice as often as you can, until you get dizzy, or you feel your stomach rebelling. You just need to get used to it at your own pace. Remember, you mother spent years telling you that falling was bad, and now, you need to undo that. It's not going to happen in one day. Push with your back foot, and "extend" your fall instead of trying to fall right in front of you. You will roll more easily, instead of landing on your shoulder.
I've been told that one of our black belts used to whine like a baby at the prospect of falling when he was a beginner. You would never have guessed it, when you see hin taking flight after a kotegaeshi.
We've all been there, be patient and consistent, and you will do it.
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Old 10-23-2007, 04:37 AM   #21
Walter Martindale
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Re: Ukemi worried

After practicing for a few years you'll find that ukemi is second nature. I've tripped while running, rolled, kept running, and then realised what had happened. Same thing over the handlebars of a bicycle - no road rash.
Patience and heaps of practice.
W
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Old 10-23-2007, 06:57 AM   #22
Angela Dunn
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Re: Ukemi worried

First off all don't panic. Any good instructor will make sure you can do these safely before throwing you into the lions den as it were. You will not be expected to know how to do them the second you walk into the dojo , all you can do is your best.

Saying that I still have trouble with them and tend to favour one side even if its not the side I am meant ot roll on

Make sure you listen to your instructor as they are the ones who are teaching you. And learn from others mistakes on forward rolls go over your shoulder instead of landing on your head and you will be fine.
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Old 10-23-2007, 07:46 AM   #23
Erik Jögimar
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Angela Dunn wrote: View Post
First off all don't panic. Any good instructor will make sure you can do these safely before throwing you into the lions den as it were. You will not be expected to know how to do them the second you walk into the dojo , all you can do is your best.

Saying that I still have trouble with them and tend to favour one side even if its not the side I am meant ot roll on

Make sure you listen to your instructor as they are the ones who are teaching you. And learn from others mistakes on forward rolls go over your shoulder instead of landing on your head and you will be fine.
Owie! I did that misstake when i did my first backroll. I got head stuck between mat and shoulders. I tried rolling straight backwards instead of over the shoulder. Damn that hurt.

Just give me your wrist!
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Old 10-23-2007, 06:05 PM   #24
Angela Dunn
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Erik Jögimar wrote: View Post
Owie! I did that misstake when i did my first backroll. I got head stuck between mat and shoulders. I tried rolling straight backwards instead of over the shoulder. Damn that hurt.
Me to! at least once a session! Lucky theres a guy in my class that knows how to treat that type of injury
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Old 10-24-2007, 01:32 AM   #25
Erik Jögimar
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Re: Ukemi worried

Quote:
Angela Dunn wrote: View Post
Me to! at least once a session! Lucky theres a guy in my class that knows how to treat that type of injury
That's good

I bet you got that horrid cracking sound too

Just give me your wrist!
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