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Old 07-24-2007, 05:34 PM   #101
ChrisHein
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Quote:
Ron Tisdale wrote: View Post
Good post Chris. One question...if someone can extend the power of their body out to their own limbs...could that change the nature of your equation?

Best,
Ron
Well I'm not really sure where you're going here, but I'd say no...

Proper body use does enable you to move your body weight and larger muscle groups (legs and back) through your arms. Making your arms more powerful. But this isn't an advantage for the grabber (uke in Aikido techniques). What he wants to do is to grab and control the center of the other guy. More links in a chain makes this harder ( the other guys elbow and shoulder). It's much simpler, and more powerful to directly grab the body. However if they are armed doing that will get you killed.

Now for the guy being grabbed it can be an advantage, But also a disadvantage. The guy being grabbed wants to stay as flexible as possible. This makes it harder for the grabber (uke) to control your center. But being able to suddenly use the power of the whole body through the limbs can make escaping much easier.

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Old 07-25-2007, 07:16 AM   #102
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Thanks Chris! While I don't always completely agree with your perspective, it seems very well thought out and logical to me.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 07-25-2007, 07:46 AM   #103
Budd
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

I'll second Ron's comment. Chris, even if I don't always agree with your conclusions, I very much appreciate the "research" (in aikido and other arts, through drills, sparring, etc.) you (and Mr. Varin) are putting into practice in order to form them.

I tend to make it out to the Bay Area (Oakland) each year. If you guys are available and close enough - I'd love to get together to vist/play and trade notes.

Best,
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:37 AM   #104
ChrisHein
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

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Budd Yuhasz wrote: View Post
I tend to make it out to the Bay Area (Oakland) each year. If you guys are available and close enough - I'd love to get together to vist/play and trade notes.

Best,
Our school is open to anyone interested in training. You're welcome any time.

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Old 07-25-2007, 09:48 AM   #105
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Excellent, thanks! Probably won't be until next winter/spring, but I'll definitely follow up with you by PM at that point.

Best,
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Old 07-26-2007, 08:52 PM   #106
Paul Sanderson-Cimino
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

This evening, I ended a reasonably long non-training spell (a month or more?), and did aikido with some friends who are also "stranded" from a dojo post-college. I tried out Chris' suggestion, and found the results pretty striking. (Although of course this is only a preliminary experience.)

We started out as for normal grappling, but one person had a tanto slipped into his or her belt. (We began with maybe slightly closer than normal kamae distance.) We pretty much stopped it as soon as one person had clearly got the knife and could strike with it, in part to avoid injuries. Aikido techniques appeared seemingly very naturally, and worked out rather well. (I felt that there was also a lot of room for judo-style sweeps.)

We also tried other setups, like the person having the tanto out and the other person having a grab of their choice. We also tried both people having tanto in their belts. We then did some with a bokken in the belt instead. The bokken actually seemed nearly useless at close range; also, body grapples seemed much more functional for the unarmed person.

Now, I should emphasize that we were a trio of aikido people, so we're arguably more prone to expecting the techniques to happen -- we might have been biased that way. I might end up trying this with a friendly wrestler or BJJer too -- I'm anxious about it appearing to be a challenge rather than an experiment, but I think it might work out with some of them. (I'll see if they wander up to us in free grappling and ask what we're doing with that wooden knife, perhaps.) I suspect there might be a wrestling way of doing this too -- but it's possible that it will end up looking a lot like aikido.
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Old 07-26-2007, 09:00 PM   #107
Paul Sanderson-Cimino
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

I'll also add that, as Chris has argued so cogently, aikido worked probably better for the person with the tanto than the person without. It was easy to forget this, and we had to remind ourselves periodically at first.
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Old 07-27-2007, 12:55 AM   #108
ChrisHein
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

HA, GREAT!

Like I've said before, you don't have to take my word for it, train it and see what happens!

Awesome Paul, please post any further results.

Tonight we trained multiple people against one armed person. A practice like this quickly gives you an understanding of why Aikido's techniques are useful and necessary.

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Old 07-27-2007, 01:09 AM   #109
CitoMaramba
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Action shot from Ken-no-tebiki practice:



Tori: Nishio Sensei
Uke: Shishiya Sensei

Inocencio Maramba, MD, MSc
Dangayan Singkaw Aikido Shinzui
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Old 07-27-2007, 09:47 AM   #110
Aikibu
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Cool Shot of Sensei there Cito.

William Hazen
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Old 07-28-2007, 12:20 PM   #111
jennifer paige smith
 
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Re: Aikido Techniques are Weapons Techniques

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
Our school is open to anyone interested in training. You're welcome any time.
I'd love to coordinate with that visit if it were possible. Let me know if any travel plans develop ( I'm a barger). Otherwise, I might just mosey on down by my lonesome if that is acceptable etiquette in your neck of the woods.

You are all welcome to come train with me at any of my dojo, if you would like. They're all in Santa Cruz, so it's a nice destination for a mini-vacation. (If you'e poet and you don't know it. Oops, hope I didn't blow it. Computer getting the better of me...best not to throw it....) Ha-Ha. Just kidding around.

Anyhow, I'd sincerely love to meet and train with any and all of you. I hope the opportunity comes soon.

Thanks, Jen

Jennifer Paige Smith
Confluence Aikido Systems
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