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Old 12-20-2006, 09:53 AM   #76
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

You spoiler! There is actually a really good movie about that...absolutely top notch. Can't remember the name of it to save my soul...

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
 
Old 12-20-2006, 10:06 AM   #77
Kevin Wilbanks
Location: Seattle/Southern Wisconsin
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

The english title is "Taboo": http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0213682/
 
Old 12-20-2006, 10:10 AM   #78
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Yep! That be the one...

B,
R

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
 
Old 12-20-2006, 10:27 AM   #79
akiy
 
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Can we please return to the subject at hand and conduct ourselves in a more respectful manner?

Thank you,

-- Jun

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Old 12-20-2006, 12:06 PM   #80
Fred Little
Dojo: NJIT Budokai
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Quote:
Jun Akiyama wrote:
Can we please return to the subject at hand and conduct ourselves in a more respectful manner?

Thank you,

-- Jun
I wholeheartedly agree with Jun's expressed view.

My very slight remark was intended to make a broader point: the notion that confused agendas of desire which might complicate training are solely related to coed training is historically nonsensical.

Such confusions have been a well documented part of the Japanese "Do" or "Michi" for a millenium or more, and we do ourselves no service by wishing for a mythical golden age in which they simply did not exist.

With apologies for any offense my remark might have occasioned.

Regards,

FL
 
Old 12-20-2006, 12:38 PM   #81
mriehle
 
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Quote:
Mike Grant wrote:
I didn't say that the 'social issues' were unimportant. I just said that they have no place in the dojo.
And I fundamentally agree with this statement, however:

Quote:
I wrote:
There are a lot of places where personal problems have no place but they intrude in any case. Simply dismissing them as unimportant is never the answer. Someone who finds themselves in such a situation needs to deal with it in a constructive and appropriate manner.
I stand by this statement.

Just because something shouldn't happen does not mean it won't happen. And I don't see this as gender linked in any way. Humans are humans and have personal issues. I fundamentally respect the person who recognizes they have a personal issue - like a crush on someone in the dojo - and that they need to go carefully in dealing with it. Maybe even realizing they need help.

As to the subject of this thread: it's possible, I think, that all that needs to be said has been said. It is, as Jun points out, in danger of becoming extremely disrespectful. I'm therefore going to not post again on this thread. If you'd like to continue this discussion I'll be happy to address it in private messages. Up to a point.

 
Old 12-21-2006, 03:07 AM   #82
Mike Grant
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Quote:
Hanna Björk wrote:
Maybe because there would be no such problem in a single-sex dojo... or maybe because all the women are in the dojo for the wrong reasons, i.e. for dating? That was the opinions of some of my ex-teachers reagarding the women who trained in Hombu Dojo in late 60s. "Their only reason to be there was trying to find a husband."

Of course, all the men are in the dojo for the right reason.
Did you succeed in finding a husband?

If you'd been Norwegian (as opposed to Swedish), your comment about trolls would have been perfect.

Rone-I'm glad you enjoyed your film...
 
Old 12-28-2006, 02:19 PM   #83
"Combat_vet"
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Quote:
Mike Grant wrote:
This (and the thread about 'people I don't want to learn from') is typical of what happens when you make it too easy for women to start training.

And, as an aside, also provides a good indication of why putting women in front line combat units also doesn't work.

For a third stab at political correctness, something that's almost as pathetc is couples who always train together.

Just get over it and get on with your training. Sort out your personal issues off the mat and away from the dojo. End of story.
Interesting.

I have served in two desert wars and one in the Balkans; I have 1300 flying hours, including F15 and F16. The main problems I noticed were the men getting injured while drinking, or hitting each other over some testosterone driven insult. Men are more suited in what way exactly? And you have how much time in combat?

Relationships happen. Adults deal with them, in and out of the dojo. Women have proved themselves in combat already, we are not waiting for your agreement.
 
Old 12-28-2006, 04:59 PM   #84
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Going back a few pages, this thread has really pushed me to the idea that Japanese is perhaps best left out of a non-Japanese dojo.

I can't imagine a Japanese aikidoka asking their sensei for advice about an on-mat crush. I suppose some people do, but not because the sensei is one's sensei but because they are one of probably many older people one might look to for advice. In Japanese society I think it would be more natural for the subject to come up while drinking with some sempai, but OTOH budo sempai/kohai relationships are not as strong in Japan as, say, college sempai/kohai, or work sempai/kohai relationships.

But the idea that the sensei is someone you should be able to trust with personal information and seek advice from, to me, goes right into what Michael was saying earlier about The Sensei. Granted, idolization of people in power happens even without Japanese titles, but I have the feeling they don't help. I think a true sensei-deshi relationship is virtually impossible outside of a Japanese context, and the title probably creates more misunderstanding than it promotes cross-cultural learning.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
 
Old 12-29-2006, 03:46 AM   #85
"Fly by night"
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Quote:
Interesting.

I have served in two desert wars and one in the Balkans; I have 1300 flying hours, including F15 and F16. The main problems I noticed were the men getting injured while drinking, or hitting each other over some testosterone driven insult. Men are more suited in what way exactly? And you have how much time in combat?

Relationships happen. Adults deal with them, in and out of the dojo. Women have proved themselves in combat already, we are not waiting for your agreement.
Sorry, but we'll have to agree to disagree. I suppose to some extent it depends on your definition of 'combat'. Sitting in a metal tube 20,000 feet above the action and firing missiles at people who can't shoot back would be one definition and I agree that there's a no problem with women doing that.

I'd also agree that women have more than proved themselves in close surveillance and other forward intelligence related roles-I'm thinking here particularly about the SOE in WW II and a number of extremely brave and effective individuals who served with them. Nobody can question their courage and commitment. (before you ask, they're in their 80s now but I have met more than one of them).

BUT, have women proved themselves in a true ground combat infantry type role? Well, the Israelis tried it and the answer is a resounding no. OK, one or two individuals might be able to cut it once in a blue moon, but that's about it.

Yes I have experience and have seen the reduced standards and all the rest. No I don't count sitting in a metal tube and firing missiles at people who can't shoot back as 'combat'.

GI Jane, my friend, is a work of fiction.
 
Old 12-29-2006, 09:17 AM   #86
Hanna B
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

*cough* is this last deviation the kind of thing that belongs in the anonymous forum?
 
Old 12-29-2006, 09:34 AM   #87
akiy
 
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Re: Crush on a Yudansha!

Thread closed due to disrespectful comments and thread drift.

-- Jun

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