Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > General

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-09-2006, 11:00 PM   #26
Aristeia
Location: Auckland
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 971
New Zealand
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Quote:
Dirk Hanss wrote:

P.S. it is funny, that some people complain about aikidoka not knowing about how to fight on the ground and others asking, why one should go down in training.
Hey Dirk - I know that that comment was made toungue in cheek but still feel it should be pointed out that there is a difference beween suwari waza and fighting on the ground.

I am a big fan of suwari waza. I think it's a great tool for improving tachi waza and learning body alignment. But it should always be pointed out that suwari waza is not newaza.

And of course there is the injury question. Not the "hey look joe just hurt his knee doing that one suwari waza technique" type injury but more the "I've been doing Aikido for 15 years, how come my knees feel like crap" injury.

"When your only tool is a hammer every problem starts to look like a nail"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 02:37 AM   #27
batemanb
 
batemanb's Avatar
Dojo: Seibukan Aikido UK
Location: body in UK, heart still in Japan
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,029
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

I`m surprised no one`s mentioned it, but practising in suwari waza is an excellent way of developing power through your hips. Working in suwari waza you have to use your hips to move, in doing technique this way, you can then transfer this movement to standing techniques which helps increase the power in your technique.

rgds
Bryan

A difficult problem is easily solved by asking yourself the question, "Just how would the Lone Ranger handle this?"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 03:38 AM   #28
Aristeia
Location: Auckland
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 971
New Zealand
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

what bryan said. Also helps to develop a general feeling of centre (which some would argue is the same thing)

"When your only tool is a hammer every problem starts to look like a nail"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 04:33 AM   #29
mathewjgano
 
mathewjgano's Avatar
Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,100
United_States
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Hi tristan,
The dojo I train at here in America does a lot of suwari waza, but it's a pretty traditional dojo from what I understand. I find if I do it regularly and stretch well before-hand, I don't get knee injuries. Suwari has helped me to move from my center a bit better and while for all I know it could be a relatively weak position to be in, it's fun to be a smaller target whipping around low to the ground sometimes. You certainly have more mobility on your knees than on your back or stomach, making it easier to dodge around...but finding a place that won't scrape up your knees can be tough. I can roll on pavement fairly well if it's also pretty clear, but when I've pushed off with my knees it quickly became painfull, regardless.
I like hanmihandachi for what seems to be a good exercise in learning about how to establish kuzushi from different heights and ranges.
Take care!
Matt

Last edited by mathewjgano : 04-10-2006 at 04:35 AM.

Gambarimashyo!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 04:38 AM   #30
mathewjgano
 
mathewjgano's Avatar
Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,100
United_States
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

...perhaps suwari is also a good way to simulate closer-quarters interactions?

Gambarimashyo!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 06:02 AM   #31
Dirk Hanss
 
Dirk Hanss's Avatar
Dojo: Aikidoschule Trier
Location: Merzkirchen
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 471
Germany
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Quote:
Michael Fooks wrote:
Hey Dirk - I know that that comment was made toungue in cheek but still feel it should be pointed out that there is a difference beween suwari waza and fighting on the ground.

I am a big fan of suwari waza. I think it's a great tool for improving tachi waza and learning body alignment. But it should always be pointed out that suwari waza is not newaza.

And of course there is the injury question. Not the "hey look joe just hurt his knee doing that one suwari waza technique" type injury but more the "I've been doing Aikido for 15 years, how come my knees feel like crap" injury.
Michael,
for me there are two reasons to train suwariwaza/hanmi handachi.
1.) If you pin someone (in seiza) and you are unexpectedly attack by a second person it is a typical hanmi handachi situation (traditionally rather being trapped in a japanese house).
2.) Suwari waza is a way to fight on groundlevel and avoid lying on the ground (newaza), being unprotected against additional opponents.

OK the other arguments are accepted, too.

The injuries are to be taken seriously and I still wonder, how millions of Japanese and other Asian folks can sit for hours in seiza over 70 years without having these problems and our knees degenerate after a few sessions of suwari waza on soft aikido mats.

Are these genetic differences or should we only force our children to move more on knees in younger years?

Regards Dirk
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 12:27 PM   #32
Kevin Leavitt
 
Kevin Leavitt's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido of Northern Virginia
Location: Stuttgart, Baden Wurttemberg
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,376
Germany
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Yes suwariwaza is a good technique for developing hip movement. I think it is the whole point of doing it...that and posture and balance.

I do it all the time in groundfighting and BJJ...you have to if you are doing jiujitsu correctly! We just don't duck walk around the mat 100 times!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 05:06 PM   #33
eyrie
 
eyrie's Avatar
Location: Summerholm, Queensland
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,126
Australia
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Well, if you can't sit and stand "properly", how can you hope to defend yourself?

Ignatius
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2006, 07:14 PM   #34
Aristeia
Location: Auckland
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 971
New Zealand
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Quote:
Dirk Hanss wrote:
.
2.) Suwari waza is a way to fight on groundlevel and avoid lying on the ground (newaza), being unprotected against additional opponents.
I personally don't think it's particularly effective as a ground fighting strategy. Most of the time if you can get to seiza you can get up altogether.
Quote:
OK the other arguments are accepted, too.

The injuries are to be taken seriously and I still wonder, how millions of Japanese and other Asian folks can sit for hours in seiza over 70 years without having these problems and our knees degenerate after a few sessions of suwari waza on soft aikido mats.

Are these genetic differences or should we only force our children to move more on knees in younger years?

Regards Dirk
My guess is that there's a difference between sitting down to eat and talk and occasionally knee walking from here to there, and doing hours of technique involving constant movement.

"When your only tool is a hammer every problem starts to look like a nail"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2006, 03:52 AM   #35
eyrie
 
eyrie's Avatar
Location: Summerholm, Queensland
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,126
Australia
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Suwari waza is merely a training tool for learning how to do aikido "correctly". It's got nothing to do with groundfighting. In fact, it's got nothing to do with fighting at all, much less responses to specified attacks. In fact, if you can do aikido from seiza - WITHOUT MOVING YOUR FEET, then you can do aikido standing up, lying down, sitting in a chair, or with your back up against a wall.

Ignatius
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2006, 04:56 AM   #36
ze do telhado
Dojo: aikishurendojo
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9
Portugal
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

hi, in my opinion swari and hanmi hantachi waza were used as indoor techniques, in the past ( and even today ) when indoor people used to stay in seiza and from that posicion they should be able to deal with any attack. in the present besides the same utilization, swari waza and hanmi hantachi waza are useful for developing strong hips and good balance.( sorry about my bad english )
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2006, 12:27 PM   #37
Suwariwazaman
Dojo: Aikido of Cincinnati
Location: Cincinnati
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 52
United_States
Offline
Re: Suwari waza

Hello from Cincinnati, We use suwariwaza alot. I agree that it is great for dealing with uke that are bigger, and it helps with proper posture. My Sensei says the answer is in the hips. Hanmihandachi is huge.
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Aikido DVDs and Video Downloads - by George Ledyard Sensei & other great teachers from AikidoDVDS.Com



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Randori No Kata - history etc DaveS Techniques 14 09-30-2006 08:59 PM
Testing requirements kyu levels arjandevries Testing 10 08-07-2006 08:26 PM
Suwari waza / Shikko help Steven Tame Techniques 6 07-03-2005 06:20 AM
Suwari waza kokyu-ho David Yap Techniques 24 08-31-2004 09:18 PM
suwari waza iriminage arvin m. Techniques 3 05-09-2001 10:31 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:48 PM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate