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Old 07-31-2001, 06:01 AM   #1
Ta Kung
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 237
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Question purpose of "tai no henko"?

I'm rather new to Aikido (that's probably stating the obvious...) and I have a few questions regarding the technique that every practise session starts with, "tai no henko".

Is it the same as what some of you call "tenkan"?

Is it always the first technique each practice session starts with, regardless of style and club?

What is the true purpose of "tai no henko"? Is it a seperate technique, or is it merely a way to get to uke's side so that you may do a "real" technique (like a throw) from there? I know that you can do that, but is tai no henko a seperate technique (it doesn't seem to have an obvious "neutralization" of uke)?

Why do you keep your arms (almost) straight when the technique is done? Is it just "the way it is", or is there some thought behind it, like a strange block or something?

Pretty strange questions, I know, please try not to taunt me.

Sincerly,
Patrik (the spelling master... not)
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Old 07-31-2001, 08:37 AM   #2
guest1234
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 915
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Hi Patrik!
question 1: I think usually "tenkan with partner"

question 2: Usually but not always (hint: even in Aikido, a question with "always" in the answer is usually not true)

remaining questions: Wouldn't it be more fun to work on that a while on your own? Kind of like asking the ending of a murder mystery, to me ...
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Old 07-31-2001, 09:17 AM   #3
lt-rentaroo
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 237
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Hello,

"Tai no Henko" and "tenkan" are essentially the same exercise. Often times "tai no henko" is the term used when the exercise is performed with a partner and "tenkan" is the term used when practicing the movement without a partner. The body movement in both cases is the same, involving a 180 degree pivoting motion. Of course, the terms will vary in use from dojo to dojo.

We do not always begin class with "tenkan", often we substitute "shomenuchi ikkyo undo", "sayu undo", or "udefori undo" (all of these are more than likely familiar to Aikidoka who are familiar with the Aikido Association of America testing guidlines). I usually determine which "warm-up" exercises we will do based upon the technique(s) that will be taught in class. For example, if Katatetori Kotegaeshi Tenkan is the technique for the evening, we will begin class by practicing the "tenkan" body movement. If we will be practicing Shomenuchi Ikkyo, then we will begin class by performing the "Shomenuchi Ikkyo Undo" exercise.

"Tai no henko" or "tenkan" are not separate techniques in themselves, meaning the exercises are used to develop proper timing and footwork that leads to better technique. You have probably noticed that practically all Aikido techniques have an Irimi (entering) and a Tenkan (turning) variation.

I think the position you maintain your arms in after the "tai no henko" or "tenkan" exercise is performed depends largely on the style of Aikido you practice. I've found that, in general, students who study Yoshinkan Aikido usaully maintain a more linear or rigid posture at the completion of "tai no henko" where as students of Aikikai Aikido usually maintain a more relaxed posture.

Well, I hope I've helped and not further confused you. Have a good day!

LOUIS A. SHARPE, JR.
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Old 07-31-2001, 09:48 AM   #4
Brian Vickery
Dojo: Aiki-Buken Aikido
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Join Date: Jul 2000
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Re: purpose of "tai no henko"?

Quote:
Originally posted by Ta Kung

What is the true purpose of "tai no henko"?

Sincerly,
Patrik (the spelling master... not)
Hi Patrik,

...besides developing proper footwork & timing, and also the concepts of irimi/tenkan which Mr. Sharpe mentioned,'tai no henko' also helps students develop proper 'mai-ai' (distancing) and 'leading control' (...moving/turning right when 1st contact is made so as to take the attacker's balance, but not pulling away hard enough to break the grab).

...look at it as a skill buiding exercise rather than a self defense technique. I'm sure you've noticed by now that their are aspects of 'tai no henko' in virtually every aikido technique!

Good luck in your training!

Brian Vickery

"The highest level of technique to achieve is that of having NO technique!"
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Old 07-31-2001, 10:22 AM   #5
Ta Kung
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 237
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Thanx for your answers! As for your comment, Colleen, I never did like murder mysteries; I guess I need to work om my patience aswell as my Aikido. I have this big problem with finding stuff out later on. I always want to know everything right away.

Best wishes,
Patrik (the man who always reads the ending of a book first!)
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Old 07-31-2001, 10:24 AM   #6
Jim23
Join Date: Jan 2001
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Patrik,

I don't know which style you train in, but this is the way we do it.

Tai no henko is one of the basic body movements (kihon dosa).

It's a method of training the body movement for when you are pulled (tai no henko ichi) or pushed (tai no henko ni). The movement for ichi is the basis of irimi (entering) and the movement for ni is the basis for tenkan (turning). For tai no henko ni we do a 95-degree turn with the back leg, although an actual completed technique could involve a 180-dergee turn.

Both ichi and ni can be performed with or without a partner. Training without a partner helps you learn how to focus power, how to enter and turn, and how to maintain a stable posture. Training with a partner helps you develop a sense of connecting with them and also how to unbalance them.

If you've ever done katate-mochi sokumen irimi-nage, you'll see why the hands/arms are held that way.

Why don't you ask your teacher to teach you more?

Jim23

Remember, all generalizations are false
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Old 07-31-2001, 11:49 AM   #7
Patrik Eng
Dojo: Billingens Aikido
Location: Sweden
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Jim,

I'm sorry for not stating what style I practise, perhaps it would have helped. I practise Iwama Ryu.

As for the reason I haven't asked my teacher... We currently have a "summer break" from training, and so I will probably not see him until the "season" starts again. And, as I staded before, I'm one of those pushy people who can't wait a second longer then I have to.

Oh yeah, one more thing. I am writing this message from home, and the one I wrote under the nick "Ta Kung" was written at work. I'm sorry for having two aliases (long story). It's not that I've got a split personality or something...

Yours in Aikido,
Patrik

PS. I'm not really that impatient in real life. Really, I'm not.

Come to the edge - No, we'll fall!
Come to the edge - No, we're afraid!
Come to the edge - And they came and he pushed them and they flew
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Old 07-31-2001, 12:41 PM   #8
Greg Jennings
Dojo: WPAFB JiuJitsu Group
Location: Springboro, OH
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Tai No Henka/Henko

It means "body shifting" or something close to that.

It's one of three basic empty-hand exercises that you, at a Iwama school, should be practicing. These are "case studies" to help you learn aikido.

The other two are: morotedori kokyuho and kokyudosa.

Together these three exercises contain all the fundamentals of aikido movement. Provided that you look for them, that is.

I see far too many people taking these exercises for granted and not _thinking_ about what they are about, trying subtly different methods of appling them, etc.

Connection, kuzushi, mind/body coordination, effecting your partner's mind...it's all there and in rich quantities at that.

Regards,

Greg Jennings
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Old 07-31-2001, 12:55 PM   #9
Erik
Location: Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 1,200
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Re: purpose of "tai no henko"?

Quote:
Originally posted by Ta Kung
Is it the same as what some of you call "tenkan"?
I don't think of it that way, although, it has a tenkan movement in it. I think of tenkan as a turning movement, whereas, I think of tai no henko as a basic blending practice which includes a turning movement. It's also done in about as many different ways as there are dojos, although the Iwama folks seem pretty consistent.

Quote:
Is it always the first technique each practice session starts with, regardless of style and club?
My home dojo rarely, if ever, practices it, whereas the Iwama dojo I occasionally visit does it every single class at exactly the same point in the class. Most dojos, if they do it, will do it at the beginning of class.

Quote:
What is the true purpose of "tai no henko"? Is it a seperate technique, or is it merely a way to get to uke's side so that you may do a "real" technique (like a throw) from there? I know that you can do that, but is tai no henko a seperate technique (it doesn't seem to have an obvious "neutralization" of uke)?
Personally, I see it a basic movement/blending practice. There are some kokyu throws and techniques which can be extended out of it but that also applies to most movements. The principles involved include elements of almost everything we do including blending, leading, extension, balance breaking, controlling center, maintaining center and a bunch more.

Quote:
Why do you keep your arms (almost) straight when the technique is done? Is it just "the way it is", or is there some thought behind it, like a strange block or something?
Think of it as leading and extending uke's center. If done correctly uke's body is somewhat bent and off-balance. If the arms aren't extended somewhat then uke can regain their balance and unless we're exceptionally good, superbly devious or very compassionate is not our preferred situation.

Hope that helped.
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Old 08-02-2001, 11:33 PM   #10
Chocolateuke
Dojo: Muhu Dojo
Location: Middle of nowhere in California 14 miles from Buellton
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hey jim you practice yoshinkan?? because I do and we do it exactly like that!! now lest practace shomen uchi nikkajo ichi! then ni!

Dallas Adolphsen
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Old 08-24-2001, 01:27 PM   #11
Mares
Location: Australia
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 89
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It's interesting you raised this point. I'm not sure if u are aware but in Gothenburg Ulf Evenas Sensei, 7th dan, has a dojo. I believe he is Morihiro Saito Sensei's representative for Northern Europe. Perhaps sometime you could visit him and seek guidance.
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