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Old 10-01-2003, 01:36 PM   #1
Clayton Kale
Dojo: Nihon Goshin Aikido Academy
Location: South Carolina
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Question Black and Blue Toe

Last night, I whacked my middle toe pretty hard against my uke's ankle when performing a technique. It popped pretty loud and stung a little, but I was able to finish class. It's now black and blue and it hurts to walk. I've read threads about broken toes (I'm not sure if mine's broken or not) and about R.I.C.E. What I want to know is: About how long did a toe injury keep you off the mat?

We're having a seminar this weekend that I've been looking forward to (it'll be my first one). Do you think I'll have to miss it? Will tape help? Any thoughts would be appreciated!

"Pefect practice makes perfect." -Steven A. Weber Godan Nihon Goshin Aikido

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Old 10-01-2003, 01:52 PM   #2
Ari Bolden
 
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Dear Clay,

I can't even begin to tell you what a pain in the butt a toe injury is. Break a toe, can't cast it, so you have to be real careful. They also never heal correctly it seems.

Broke my big toe abot 8 years ago on the mat (got thrown when doing randori with my sensei and caught my toe between the mats).

Couldn't shikko for a year and could really do suwari waza for that long as well. Had a seminar 2 weeks later for a belt test. My sensei told our Shihan about it. He said no problem.

Just make your partners aware of it. My toe still bothers me to this day and doesn't have range of motion it had before.

Tape will help. Just keep aware from shikko ansuwari waza. Don't push it or it will never let you forget it's there.

Cheers

Ari

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Old 10-01-2003, 02:10 PM   #3
Clayton Drescher
 
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I think I broke my little toe this summer, had to take a week off the mat, then taped it real good and tried not to spin on it. It looks funny now, but hasn't hurt in several months. It took a little over a month before I was back to my normal techniques. The worst part was wearing shoes those first couple weeks.
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:34 PM   #4
PeterR
 
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It makes no difference if the toe is broken or dislocated - pain and treatment are the same.

My only advice is even after its stopped hurting use tape to add support.

If its still hurting - regular warm foot baths. I assume enough time has past beyond the icing stage.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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Old 10-01-2003, 07:41 PM   #5
mattholmes
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I would suggest "buddy-taping" the toe: tape the injured toe by itself first (for support) and then wind the tape around it and the toe next it (more support).

I broke a couple of my toes in karate about three years ago (I front kicked, she blocked with her shin, I was being lazy and didn't have my toes pulled back yet. Ouch.), training for a tournament. I iced it like crazy, buddy taped it, and competed with only slight discomfort four days later. It is crooked now, though...
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Old 10-01-2003, 08:23 PM   #6
PeterR
 
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Good point about the buddy taping - I assumed he would understand but I have been amoung the others that didn't get the obvious and paid the price.

I would also caution against wrapping too tight - its not necessary for the support.

I dislocated and nearly ripped my toe off when I lost it while being hard pressed by Luther - a man I might add lived up to his name on the mat.
Quote:
Matt Holmes (mattholmes) wrote:
I would suggest "buddy-taping" the toe: tape the injured toe by itself first (for support) and then wind the tape around it and the toe next it (more support).

I broke a couple of my toes in karate about three years ago (I front kicked, she blocked with her shin, I was being lazy and didn't have my toes pulled back yet. Ouch.), training for a tournament. I iced it like crazy, buddy taped it, and competed with only slight discomfort four days later. It is crooked now, though...

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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Old 10-01-2003, 10:51 PM   #7
bcole23
Dojo: Eagle Rock Aikido, Ammon, ID
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I've just recently come back from breaking my index toe (Yes, I have a big toe, index toe, birdie toe, ring toe, and pinkie toe; I've been told others only have a big toe and 4 other toes). Anywhoo, the main thing you can do is give it time to heal!!! If you don't then you'll have a partially healed, utterly nagging injury that will just never go away. I was out for 6 weeks and in that time, I've treated my toe like a king. Now, I'm doing toe rehab every day, rebuilding the atrophied muscles in that one toe and trying to get the joints flexible again. I've broken 3 different toes and can tell you this from my experience, the closer the toe to your pinkie toe, the more effective buddy wrapping is for me. The closer to the big toe, buddy wrapping is actually detrimental to the healing process because the toes in this area are more articulate and tend to actually pull on the effected toe more. But that's just my opinion.

Also, when I first had my toe broken (irimi tenkan right on the toe), I thought it was dislocated because of the angle and where the angle originated. I'm certainly glad that I had it x-rayed and didn't try to pop it back in. You may have a cracked joint or something worse. If you have insurance, I'd get it looked at just in case.

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Old 10-02-2003, 02:48 AM   #8
Alan Lomax
Dojo: Doumukai Aikido
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Re: Black and Blue Toe

Quote:
Clayton Kale wrote:
What I want to know is: About how long did a toe injury keep you off the mat?
Toe injuries are so common in Martial Arts in general, they are not even mentioned much. Good on you for bringing it up. Enquiring minds want to know about these things and may have been shy to ask. I haven't met anyone on the mat yet that has not suffered some sort of toe injury at some time.

The good news; all of the advisement previously listed is just what you need.

The not as good news; as most of us fail to get any younger, our bodies like to remind us of the process by bringing our attention back(often) to previous injuries. Our toes are no exception.

Some more really good news; you don't have to miss a day on the mat.

Some news that kinda blows; it all depends on your pain tolerance and the possible onset of infection.

Recommendation; take care of your body and it will take care of you. You should consider that under most circumstances both you and your body should be thought of as a unit for the purposes of care and maintenance.

Best regards

Alan Lomax
Doumukai Aikido
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Old 10-02-2003, 01:19 PM   #9
Clayton Kale
Dojo: Nihon Goshin Aikido Academy
Location: South Carolina
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Thumbs down

Many, many thanks to you all! I've taken it easy this week, treating my toe to hot baths. And I'm definitely going to the seminar this weekend.

Again, Thank you all.

"Pefect practice makes perfect." -Steven A. Weber Godan Nihon Goshin Aikido

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Old 10-02-2003, 01:32 PM   #10
BC
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A friend of mine in our dojo broke his big toe during a seminar, right before his 3rd kyu test. In our organization, that test has a significant amount of suwari and hanmi handachi waza. He still tested, but needless to say, he was in some serious pain during the test.

I've broken almost all of my toes over the years. In every case but one, it resulted from practicing martial arts. I once broke two toes at the same time, with two fractures in each toe. The pain was so intense that I couldn't even touch my heel to the ground for almost two weeks. In most cases though, I think you should be able to practice, as long as you take it easy. If you don't take it easy, you could end up like me. My toes make so much noise when I walk in bare feet that it sounds like I'm cracking nuts.

Robert Cronin
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Old 10-03-2003, 01:30 PM   #11
Richard Cardwell
Dojo: Belfast Aikido Circle
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On the subject of toes, I have quite severely "hammer" toes on both feet, caused by curling them when I was a small child- the bones hardened and my toes are now all permanently bent. It doesn't affect my balance, but makes suwari waza for any period of time uncomfortable. Does anyone else have this problem, and if so, how would they deal with it, if at all?

Thanks, RAJC
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Old 10-08-2003, 11:34 PM   #12
Jeanne Shepard
 
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I find suwari waza painful, not because of my knees, which seems to be the usual complaint, but because of a bunion.

I try to stretch the web space between my big toe and next (index) toe, plus stretch it back.

This helps, a little.

I still don't like suwari waza.

Jeanne
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