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Old 01-24-2012, 10:01 AM   #80
Cliff Judge
Location: Kawasaki, Kanagawa
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,276
Re: bokken suburi questions

Alex Megann wrote: View Post
Given Carsten's statement, it doesn't look to me that they are discriminating about aikido in particular! It seems to me quite reasonable that the statutes of the ryu might forbit cross-training in any other discipline.

You seem to be eliding over quite a bit of what Carsten has posted.

Carsten M�llering wrote: View Post
As far as I was told, the main difference is the "spirit" of fighting. I was told that you can not develop the "true spirit" of KSR when practicing aikido. (Interestingly Tissier often talks about the spirit of the swordwork, derived from KSR by Inaba sensei, being exactly the thing that interested him so much.)
And that you can not reach a true undestanding of the philosophy or esoteric teaching of KSR.
Carsten M�llering wrote: View Post
And I don't think that this is the point: Through my discussions with German members of the KSR I learned, that the decision of not allowing aikidoka to enter the ryu has very deep contentual reasons. They truely think that someone who practices aikido has made decisions - in his mind and his body - which don't allow him to use body and mind to do what has to be done or to think was has to be thought when doing KSR.
Carsten M�llering wrote: View Post
ISome years ago I had long and interesting conversations with a member (not the one holding the menkyo kaiden) of the German shibu of the KSR. And it became very clear, that the ban of aikidoka in the KSR shibu is founded in the teachings of the ryu. It seems to become evident when you practice long enough to understand what Frieday calls "the kabbala" of the ryu: The inner teachings, the "ura" doctrine.
Whether it is true that there is such a deep gap between the inner teachings of KSR and aikido I am not able to judge.

There exist, as far as I know, only three European shibu of the KSR. In 2008/9 when I was in contact with the shibu in Frankfurt/Germany they indeed required to drop all other arts entirely: No aikido, no kendo, no other koryu budo, even no boxing or tai chi.
Maybe things have changed since then concerning other arts. But aikido is still excluded.
And let me reiterate something I have said, that it is fully reasonable for Kashima Shinryu instructors to choose the students they want to teach, for whatever reasons, and to give the public any story they want to give about why they chose them.

I just think the stuff that Carsten is saying - which is just his own experience talking to members of the group in Germany, I hope everyone realizes - makes them sound kind of crazy.
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