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Old 01-21-2005, 07:42 PM   #47
Casey Martinson
Dojo: Meishinkan Dojo/Lehigh Acres
Location: Florida
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 30
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Re: Taking the high road

Paul: "I thought I mentioned Mits Yamashita. He would be the guy to talk to about this, as he's an aikido shihan and skilled bjj'er."

Yes, I saw your original mention. But he has not posted to this particular threat. Will still consider that good advice however.

Lynn: "I must admit to the humor and the irony that on a thread called "Taking the higher road" we have mostly discussed take-downs, grappling, and ground work. LOL"

That has definitely been in my mind as well. Perhaps the "high road" could be seen as a metaphor for the road of staying on one's feet. Interesting that it worked out that way though; not at all what I intended in writing that title.

Michael: "Well cross training is the start. If you try training aikido responses to a shot without cross training then you'll likely be dealing with a poor shot and the results of your experiment will be skewed."

Good point. Or if you want to save time you could find a skilled grappler to train with. Perhaps you don't need to be skilled in takedowns yourself to develop skill in defending against them, as long as you hone that skill against somebody who does know their takedowns.

Michael: "Why is it important that we have a specifically and uniquely Aikido response to an attack like this?"

From what I have seen, the sprawl involves sort of shooting your legs behind you while you secure a hold on your opponent's shoulders or head or gi or whatever? Is that correct? If it is, then it seems like your center of gravity is way out over your supporting limbs (your legs). Is it not fundamental to aikido to stay centered and grounded? That has been my impression so far. If my line of reasoning isn't totally half baked then, once you're in the sprawl, would it not be difficult to regain a grounded posture? You may escape the takedown, but then you have entered into a grappling contenst where the odds are not in your favor. One thing that seems very practical about the aikido immobilizations I've seen and practiced is that they leave you (standing or kneeling) in a good position to escape or defend against other attackers. Submission holds that win grappling fights seem to often leave you entangled with the opponent? In a real life scenario, once you've got your opponent in an arm bar with your legs across his neck, then what? Break his arm? That doesn't seem quite aiki. And defending against a second attack from that kind of position would seem pretty challenging also.

Robert, thanks for the tip.

Kevin, your thoughts seem logical to me. No doubt, MMA/BJJ training has got to be geared toward combat effectiveness--at least against one unarmed opponent. I think the overall effectiveness potential of aikido is probably greater than that of MMA/BJJ. In principle, aikido should be undefeatable because it does not "fight"; it calls on the power of the universe to restore natural order. In practice, that is obviously an idealistic path that may take decades to realize. MMA/BJJ has a much quicker learning curve, so for the first couple decades, it may offer a more realistic path of self defense. Ultimately however, I can't imagine a UFC champ continuing to refine his art of combat as old age begins to take its toll. If the stories of O'Sensei are even half true, I'll wager he could hold his own against the best UFC has to offer, even at the age of 80. That's pretty incredible. Will the MMA champs be able to defend their titles at 80? Probably not.
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