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Old 05-30-2006, 10:06 AM   #424
Mike Sigman
Location: Durango, CO
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,123
United_States
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Re: The "Jo Trick" and Similar Exercises

Quote:
Mark Freeman wrote:
I accept that there are physical explanations to all of these 'tricks' but it seems there are few exponents of the 'mind's' side in the equation.
Of course correct alignment of the skeleton is crucial, as is movement from the centre. This allows for the most efficient and effective use of the body. These basic skills are easy for some and difficult for others.
Mark, good alignment is a plus, for several reasons not just the transmission of the force, but it's not critical. If you really have good mind/body skills, the particular alignment is not that critical. But we're nowhere near that sort of discussion on this forum, as far as I see.
Quote:
With an exercise like 'unraisable body' all the mechanical explanation in the world would not help me 'get' this, I learnt it through being taught different ways of thinking.
I can explain it pretty clearly, Mark, but it would mean introducing factors we're not discussing in the thread and which take some practice to understand. I.e., what I'm saying is that any feat which has physically demonstrable effects can be analysed physically.
Quote:
Human beings are dynamic creatures we are moved by our will, our bodies carry out our intentions. When being lifted as in the unraisable body exercise, the lifters mind is going up, my mind is also 'up' and therefore in agreement not conflict, and surprisingly 'unliftable' This goes against 'logic' and I have no idea how a 'mechanic' would vector the whole process. This can be learned by a beginner in a few minutes, but to be able to keep this state under pressure is going to take much practice, as Dan and Mike have both written about
When taken a step further, this exercise can be progressed as follows, when the lifter goes to lift they tend to naturally dip down befor they go up under the arms to attempt to raise the body of the 'stander', if at this precise moment and the trick is in the timing, the stander 'agrees' with this 'down' by thinking 'down' himself, the lifter is put at a great disadvantage, they can't seem to generate any upward power.
This is of course an exercise, I can do it as can many others, If you haven't done it before and you try it and it doesn't work for you, don't come back to me saying it's rubbish, it's just that you don't know how to do it.
The mind leads the body, this is ultimately the reason that 'effortless' aikido is possible, this is greatly helped by practice in these ki/internal skills. I'm sure that 'good' aikido happens without explicit training in ki developement. The best way to get these skills if you want them is to train with a teacher who has mastered them him/herself. I don't know in the larger scheme of things how many teachers are in this category. I was just lucky that I happened to practice with someone who can do and teach a multitude of the types of 'exercise' under discussion.
I see your perspective, Mark, and my position is that there are much clearer ways to describe and analyse what you've just talked about. IMO, if you really understand what is going on, then you can apply the principles like an engineer does, to relevant situations. If you just know what to do in certain situations, it's more of a "technician's" approach. What do you think physically happens to your body when you do the "unraisable" trick. Where, for instance, is the force coming from? How does it get to the lifters' hands? And so on?

Regards,

Mike Sigman
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