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Old 05-01-2008, 07:19 AM   #48
philippe willaume
 
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Re: Functional Origins of Aikido/Daito-Ryu Techniques

Quote:
Paul Sanderson-Cimino wrote: View Post
That's an interesting historical narrative, but I guess I'm talking on a more basic and specific level. The description above talks about its origins in "battlefield" arts, for armed and armored warriors. Is the idea then that aikido is based on grappling optimized for people wearing armor? I've never worn samurai armor, but my hunch is that it'd compel some changes from standard aikido movement.

Furthermore, I don't remember ever seeing Ueshiba-sensei or his students demonstrate in armor, or even move in a manner that seemed particularly reminiscent of someone in armor.

It's an interesting theory, though. Unfortunately, it seems rather hard to test. (You'd need to host some grappling matches with sets of armor.) Does anyone have knowledge of armored fighting methods from koryu studies? What are they like, technically?
Well coming from the medieval German side where you do have wrestling in armour and on horse.(all from one manual but there is at lest 4or 5 other manual from different author on the same tradition in the 15th century)
an itallian fiel harness is about 35 kg (the weight of a o-yoroi) and a german field harness is about 25 kg

The secret technique are nikkio an a sort ok kotegeishi-shiro. (European 15th century armour is king of ikkio proof but you find ikkio in "naked wrestling" (wrestling without armour)
On horse you have irimi nague, tenchi nague, sankkio, and kote geishi
In fact lot of aikido technique are found in the "or wrestling with weapon (the best being a kind of jije garame koshinague.). and it is clearly stated the normnal wrestling cajn be used when fighting with weapon via the use of a technique (verkerer, reversal) that make your entry safe.

Basically what I am alluding at is that may be , like medieval time in Europe, wrestling in medieval japan was as much integrated as it was a stand alone

Ps
May be that will help your nightmare paul.

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