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Old 02-10-2008, 07:29 PM   #36
Upyu
Dojo: Aunkai, Tokyo
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 591
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Re: Freeform Bokken Drills to Develop Aiki Flow

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
John and Mike,

Lets avoid I Li Chi for a moment then and just call the sequence in simple English.

How about: The mind directs the body mechanics and mechanical force follows.
Woot! That's the kind of talk I was going for. Thanks Chris
We will be talking about "dynamics"…. Not "statics".

I have a multitude of ways to use intent and mechanical advantage to create maximum force. I will explain more deeply one of them.

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
Robert Smith wrote under the pen name of John Gilbey for a while. Two books… One was something like "Secret Fighting Arts of the World". They were meant to be funny but each chapter had a kernel of real truth in them as well. One chapter was called the "dinky little punch". It was a shortened version of Pi Chen, the first movement in Hsing-I. That chapter makes a great study (if you have some time to to read it) and is the one punch I will describe.
I used to love that book!
Couple of quibbles I have about Robert Smith is that while he was a great documenter of boxing styles...I definitely never gave what he wrote much thought with regards to his analysis/description of "how-to's".
Actually we do Pi-chuan here in Tokyo...actually more like all we practice from Hsing-i is Pi...which can be a "#$"# and a half if you've been doing it for 30 min straight.

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
I think that is why internal (Tai Chi, Hsing-I and Paqua) Chinese boxers display their skill with the Tai Chi-style "uproot". It displays mechanical force and momentum without injuring someone. When you strike with this uprooting force or whether you just uproot someone, the guy should go flying 10-20 feet…. Especially if you have an "uber dantien (hara)". The strike is really anti-climatic except in a fight.
I agree

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
As already said, my distance is different than what you (john) are doing. They say fighting a man is like taking a walk. They also say you should walk through the person like he is not there. If you see the opponent as a barrier, momentum and mechanical force is stymied by your mind and different leverages occur within the body mechanics because your mind doubts its ability to blow through the object. Thus Hsing-I is often referred to as "mind-Form boxing". From my experience, it uses the sequence I am referring to.
But there's a catch to that kind of thought.
Most boxers will tell you to "blow through" the other side. Muay thai trainers will tell you to kick 6 inches through the other side.
Problem with that is that you end up disconnecting the body in an effort to overcommit.
Instead of that, for training purposes anyways, I always have an equal amount "pulling me back" as I commit my weight forward.
Never seen you strike so I can't comment. But I remember seeing you overcommit your weight in the forward direction in one of your videos (during a throw I think), Which resulted you in temporarily losing your balance. Assuming you always have an equal "tension" in your body pulling you back, you're always in an equalized state. (Fully committed without being commited).

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
No Mental Barriers
There is no surface hitting when a freight train blows through you. To do the kind of sparring you are doing in the videos is to do "tappy-tappy" to each other in a boxing or medium range.
I understand where you're getting at. I think I mentioned it in one of my videos, but my partner complained I was hitting "way to hard", even though the strikes only look like their "tappy tappy". Actually at one point, in a seperate sparring session I added just a bit of connection from the rear leg to my lead jab, nailing my sparring partner (amateur kickboxin champ) in the eye. Went down like a sack, the back of his eye(inside) hurt for over a week.
In these sessions I'm pretty much only looking for movement, alignment, and working on balance. Nothing more.

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
Chen Tai Chi- style whipping might help at this range, but I personally prefer to close distance while gaining momentum with my lower body, then I place a lead hand on you to (1) destabilize your spine, (2) reduce your base and (3) place you at the edge of your balance. Then my punch follows, into the cavity I have created by destabilizing your spine. Watch Cheng Man Ching or Hung I Shiang uproot someone.
Er Cheng Man Ching...? I dunno, he's got some great lower body connection that he uses from the push...but if you ask me its still pretty sloppy. Look at the over commitment he does in a couple of vids against rank beginners. Hung I Shiang is a different story
That aside...the think you describe pretty much only works against someone that doesn't have a connected body I think.
You're describing lower body weight transfer, pure and simple.

I think there's a lot more that could be done with the legs to generate more effecient force. One way is using the front leg, pass it in a saggital circle to the rear, to execute a cross ( since the rear hand is already hooked up to the front foot).

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
but driving down would penetrate and do the most damage. That is because the opponent's legs cannot collapse fast enough. The resistance in the legs provided enough resistance for the punch to penetrate better. I use this format once I have an opponent in an unstable position. I can uproot, or down root the next push or punch.
Right but how? If you ask me, there's more than a couple ways to do it "simply", while there's another way that can't really be seen on the outside

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post

The whip begins at the feet, goes through the legs, is directed by the waist and ends up in the hand, elbow, shoulder or whatever you are hitting with. The problem is that with wide stances that are 50-50 or 70-30, two spirals of energy are started; one through both soles of the feet and going through each leg.
But only if they're disjointed/unconnected. If both legs are connected, say like a bridge, then this is definitely not the case.

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
Many folks try to increase the momentum by whipping the spine at lumbars 4 and 5. This will ruin your back. It will tear the connective tissue at your fascettes, weaken the stabilizer muscles in your lower back, and may create rupture of a disk.
That's just dumb, and shows no understanding of connection
(People that whip their spine I mean)

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
John's kicks have a wide corridor (about 3 feet). His pelvis and leg mass combined with the whip has some damaging capability. But look at the photo of Hung I Shiang doing a front thrust kick in Robert Smith's "Chinese Boxers Master's and Methods". Imagine his torso coming at you and his foot connecting when his pelvis is about 1.5 feet from your pelvis. His extension will go about two feet past your spine….A steam roller baby…
Are you referring to these kicks?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nk-HLVl9LNo
Man I should update those vids.... soo oold ^^;
Anyways, I'm definitely not whipping anything in these vids. All I'm doing is maintaining a connection to the sole of my supporting leg and directing it forward. Walking forward if you will. (Especially in the front kick)

There's a lot I could add to it, slamming the middle down into my supporting leg as I kick, open/close of the body, etc, but it was just an illustration of "equllibrium", and what "true mass" really is.

Quote:
Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
No manner of chi development or direction will travel effectively past poor body mechanics. Thus the mind has to direct the body. When the body moves efficiently and when the mind does not hesitate to go through the "barrier" that an opponent presents, all manner of chi is at your disposal. The universe will supply it without you having tgo over define it. In fact, if you try to over define it (chi), you might shackle or otherwise hinder it with the mental images that the words produce. Simple enough, do not chase the chi. Use the mind to direct the body and chi will follow.
Ok...
I could be wrong, but I *think* I have a good grasp on where you're coming from.
And I'd say with 90% certainty from your statement above that you're missing a huge portion in terms of body mechanics.
You got a good frame, good weight transfer, even connection on the saggital plane to a certain degree.

But nothing you've described (in words or the video) shows that you know how to manipulate your middle (particularly with regards to slamming the middle down into the feet), or using the open/close of the body to effect a hit. If you could find someone that knows how to do these things I think you could add a substantial amount of power to your strikes.
The way you described the "whipping" pretty much shows, I think, that you don't understand the "open/close" of the body. It's this sudden open/close that gives "Pi", and actually almost all strikes in CMA its power.

And that's without getting into actual whole body connection in a "store/release" fashion.

This relates directly to "Chi". It is "definable", since you have to be using something in the human body. Plain and simple. Since you can't define it, you don't use it. No shame in it. Personally I can't make much use of it since it isn't strong enough yet, but it does have the potential to be a huge additive down the line. (Assuming I persist in breath training ^^; )

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Chris Parkerson wrote: View Post
Perhaps our disagreement is just about words. certainly no call to accuse someone of being a sham.
Well, disagreement is one thing, but you are "wrong" about the words, lol
Seriously, I'd at least get the wording straight.
There's iron clad physiological logic behind why it's Yi->Qi->Jin/Li (Li as in strength) is the way it is.

Oh and "Jing" is sperm essence....definitely use "Jin"
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