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Old 10-02-2008, 07:19 AM   #124
DH
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
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Re: How Long and In What Manner to Great Mastery?

Quote:
Jim Sorrentino wrote: View Post
Hello Mark, And yet nobody suggested that Ueshiba should enter the sumo world and compete --- they all seemed to accept that he and his art did not have to "prove" themselves in that arena. What do you make of that?

And what of Ueshiba's (or Sagawa's or Kodo's or Takeda's) other skills?
They were all more than "guys who could pass the push test".

Just for starters, the "greats": 1) trained obsessively, maniacally, to the exclusion of normal relationships with others; 2) lived far more physically challenging lives than the average post-war, Western aikidoka; and 3) practiced frequently with kohai, sempai and sensei who were quite skilled themselves.

Jim
Jim
You spend a lot of time being seemingly contrary, and stressing either aikido and or simply skills over the power inherent in this type of training. Or at least that Aikido skills are equal to this training

You have met and trained with people who train this way as well. Your statements - when viewed as a whole in many posts - seem to express an opinion this training appears to be just another *thing* you need to do, just another *tool* in your tool box.that is marginally or partly useful in your Aikido. This would exaplin your notion of obesseeive training against multiple arts and kohei and sempai and many hours training in waza.

Am I correct then in reading you, that apparently you feel you can handle Ark or Mike with your Aikido? That what they do is fine, but really your aikido skills would take them apart? If not-why not?

I find this curious as I have seen a totally different response. Everyone I have met from 3rd Dan to 6th dan, has decided what I am doing....that the training I've shown and what they feel I am displaying- in use-is the essence of aikido. They have decided this almost immediately

So...why do you think there is such a different view between them and you?
You never seem to support the idea that these skills are also stand alone power in use, you don't state it, and only stress the obverse view -such as in your quote above- when the subject is brought up. All while only talking about a push test.
Is this how you currently see these skills-as push tests? That's fine if it's due to the fact that it's all you been shown at your current level is just push tests, so its all you are currently able to assess? However, if you have been shown more, why not talk about that-since you brough it up. In other words, if you have been shown more, are your comments, in reducing these skills only to push tests, designed to demean this type of training or marginalize it? Or genuinely how you feel? If your comments are genuine, and not political I guess it explains why you still see Ueshiba's power as waza training.

I find it curious as I'd bet that on any day I could take your entire Aikido skill set apart and stop you cold, while...only...using these skills without any defined waza at all. For some reason, I think I'd include both Ark and Mike in that bet as well.
Can you see how that can be the case? If not, why do you suppose you can't see that?
Being that I find your sentiments curious I'm wondering;
How do you see these skills- in light of or in comparison to-your aikido skill sets?

Last edited by DH : 10-02-2008 at 07:31 AM.
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