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Old 05-09-2010, 12:42 AM   #67
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
Re: Yoshinkan and "aiki"

Oisin Bourke wrote: View Post
While it's fine for people to follow this line of thinking, I think it oversimplifies the value of learning the traditional arts. There's so much more going on in these arts than "efficient movement".

I think of a Jazz saxophone player listening to a shakuhachi player and dismissing it on the grounds that it wouldn't "work"
in the Blue Note on a Saturday night. You're judging something based on criteria that it was never meant to be judged on.

A huge number of traditional skills/bodies of knowledge have been wiped out across Europe over the past few centuries because they weren't "efficient"and we're all the poorer for it now.

Dismissing traditional traditional modes of learning/transmission merely because they're inconvenient to our current lifestyles is shortsighted IMO.
That's interesting
This has nothing to do with altering the traditional arts. You are offering an opinion about a method. .Do you understand what I and others are discussing?
I have read this type of criticism on another forum. I am guessing, and truly only guessing that this type of critique comes from a presumption that we are teaching newbies and influencing them. This is a false assumption. The majority of people training this way are teachers or people with many years in the arts, all more than capable of making decisions on their own. As I stated above many are senior level teachers, some experts in their own right so some of the fears sound overwrought and generally do not address the realty of the training going on. I would very much enjoy hearing why you think it is harmful to any tradition. Seriously.
Here are a few questions of interest.

1. What does it have to do with learning/altering the traditional arts?
2. How is it harmful? In what way?
3. How is it changing the tradition in your view?
4. Do you suppose that of the hundreds of people now training this way-they want to quit/ alter/ make a fuss in some way? Instead they make positive comments about the effect on their training.

I teach teachers (for the most part)
5. Are you supposing men who have been in the arts for three, four and five decades are not capable of making decisions about their own training and traditions?
6. Have you spoken with them? What have they told you? Who are they?
7. SInce they comprise teachers of Koryu, hundreds of years old, teachers up to Shihan in Aikido, teachers of Daito ryu, teachers of traditional Karate,....what would you say to them about this training effecting their traditions?
FWIW, I am member of koryu myself, hundreds of years old, other members of which who train this way read these pages.
8. What would you say to us about this training and our ability to make decisions affecting our own tradition that we have not considered ourselves?

Thank you for any thoughts
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