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Old 01-04-2011, 08:25 PM   #47
David Orange
Dojo: Aozora Dojo
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,511
Re: Direction of Groundpath

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
1) You CANNOT eliminate them, any more than you can eliminate waves in the ocean.
Maybe I should have said that the goal is to present oneself in such a way that no opponent can access the shear potential in one's own structure. That is, so that no push finds purchase in distorting your posture or moving your feet but encounters direct contact with solid ground on touch. Most of what you describe also sounds like it takes a good bit of movement, too, instead of some of the fundamental unmoving skills such as described in the baseline skills thread and the spear thrusting thread. Your graphs then could be time sketches of an ordinary aikido technique. And it does not follow that they relate to IS development.

So the goal of IS as I read it is to use the strength of the earth through postural management to prevent an opponent from accessing one's physical shear potential while using this non-shearing presentation to feed the attacking power back into the opponent's own shear points.

But how is that done?

Tim Fong has put himself on the line with his thread on spear thrusting, attempting exact physical descriptions of what he understands Ark to be teaching. And Mike, Dan and Rob have done the same with voluminous descriptions of what they physically do to achieve effects "like" you describe. However, some of them have said that your descriptions don't relate to what they actually do.

You've said you can do anything Mike can do on tape and that you can do various things that Ark does. But you've never met either of them (or Rob or Dan) and you've never experienced what their power really feels like. Are you sure you're doing anything on the magnitude of what they do?

The lack of real description of physical work methods and the way you deal with Dan are not indicative to me of the kind of fearless spirit I would expect in a black belt martial artist with internal power development, so that's where you lose some credibility with me. If you want to talk about Martial Valor, the first element is the willingness to step up. Without that fundamental, the rest is just form.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
The body moves in this way according to the principles illustrated in the kokyu undo, most particularly, happo (or zengo) undo, funatori undo, ude furi, and tekubi furi.
However, very few people attribute these movements with developing power like Mike, Dan, Ark and Rob. So is there something different in the way you do these movements that has given you ability like Mike, Dan, Ark and Rob?

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
2) Your second point is a question that betrays our fundamental crosstalk. You are looking for a set of defined problem events with determined solutions;
I'm not looking for a set of anything. Just give me one example in physical terms of using your arms, legs, center and head. What do you do in the basic aikido exercises that gives you internal powers when it doesn't do that for most people?

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
Your third criticism is simply misplaced given what I am actually doing. I am not using abstractions but concretes -- accurate diagrams of perceptible physical conditions, and mechanically admissible physical examples of common experience.
And I'm sure an engineer could build a doozy of a bridge or an apartment building or something out of those diagrams, but common experience? Why do you think so many people (who have encountered the power of people like Dan, Ark, Rob and Mike) tell you these descriptions are irrelevant to their experience?

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
These are used to illustrate concrete shapes of dynamics --which can be perceived. I keep a length of chain in the dojo to demonstrate some of them -- does that sound like "intellectualism"?
But how do you keep your own whip energy from rebounding back into your own body? Ark can do that to you.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
I show students how, when a throw is begun in kuzushi -- the static balance sphere is plainly overcome but that while flat on the feet is more statically stable, using the applied shear of the throw itself to throw the heels forward first results in a far greater dynamic range of the balance sphere, and even kaeshiwaza if applied properly.
If that paragraph is not sheared thinking, it's definitely fractured writing.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
It only works because I use the shear applied to the body to shear other parts of my body to absorb some of the shear and be able to convert the rest to advantage without conscious (and slow) intermediation. Physics is faster than neurology. Does that sound "impractical" to you ?
It sounds like you're using a lot of mechanical analysis to describe some stuff that anyone might experience in aikido training but few would bother to wind it up like that because there doesn't seem to be any real applicability and the intricacies are thus pointless.

And to get specific: "I use the shear applied to the body to shear other parts of my body to absorb some of the shear and be able to convert the rest to advantage without conscious (and slow) intermediation" sounds like a sort of braced-together homemade attempt at IS based on gyroscopics. I say "braced-together" because it does not strike me at all as the kind of thing I experienced with Dan and Ark, but it does sound like a kind of description of what I have encountered in many, many "mainstream" aikido dojos I've visited. Real internal skill can be applied without stepping or much movement at all. I don't think your descriptions are approaching that kind of thing.

[quote=Erick Mead;271708I use what I speak of. Tolerably well, I am told. I am not seeking to win converts or disciples -- I just want to get closer to truth in all respects. This is truth as far as it goes, and I'll be the first to say I have farther to take it yet.[/QUOTE]

The only place you need to be taking anything is to the next seminar available from Dan, Mike or Ark if you want any credibility on this subject. You say you can do what Ark does. I say, "Just go and feel it." Then I'll be glad to hear what you say about IS.


"That which has no substance can enter where there is no room."
Lao Tzu

"Eternity forever!"
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