AikiWeb Aikido Forums - View Single Post - "Hidden in Plain Sight"

Ellis Amdur · 09-20-2009, 07:34 PM

John Driscoll has pretty definitely demonstrated that every one - but one - technique in Ueshiba's aikido is contained within the Daito-ryu curriculum. (The one waza is aikido koshinage - for which John makes a very plausible case that it came from Yagyu Shingan-ryu) - http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?filter[1]=John%20Driscoll&t=15096 AND http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?filter[1]=John%20Driscoll&t=14306

In the 1920's, according to Takeshita Isamu's diary, Ueshiba reportedly was doing a lot of research on how to counter judo and "Kito-ryu" - (the exact meaning of what is meant by the latter is unknown, as far as the West is known - Kito-ryu as a school was already almost extinct - I've dealt with that a little in HIPS). From then, according to his students, Ueshiba was apparently "aikifiying" everything - as Sugino quotes him, "In aiki we do it this way."
So in short, if the accounts are correct, we have:

Ueshiba doing martial arts - somewhat - and getting to be a really strong man
Meets Takeda Sokaku - learns Takeda's jujutsu and probably some aiki
Ayabe - r-e-a-l-l-y learns aiki and TRAINS - (remember, this is the guy practicing with his spear in the garden and stabbling so deeply in a cheery tree that they had to cut off the spear shaft and leave the spear head in the trunk of the three).
Continued training with Takeda on an intermittent and increasingly fraught basis for another 15 or so years - AND studies countering judo.
Increasing study of weapons - not enrolling in schools - auditing at best, and mostly observing - and "aikifying" it.
Increasingly making (his) aiki(do) his own - combining all the while with his spiritual pursuits - so, by post war, his art was his own method, with an individualized way of training for power.

Oh yeah - Mark points out that it is impressive the "little" amount of time it took for him to improve - not twenty years. Part of that is surely talent. But I think we should count in minutes of training, not years. And then, make it - minutes of REAL training.
Best
Ellis Amdur

09-20-2009, 07:34 PM	#11
Ellis Amdur Location: Seattle Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 934 Offline	Re: "Hidden in Plain Sight" - Takeda Sokaku John Driscoll has pretty definitely demonstrated that every one - but one - technique in Ueshiba's aikido is contained within the Daito-ryu curriculum. (The one waza is aikido koshinage - for which John makes a very plausible case that it came from Yagyu Shingan-ryu) - http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?filter[1]=John%20Driscoll&t=15096 AND http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?filter[1]=John%20Driscoll&t=14306 In the 1920's, according to Takeshita Isamu's diary, Ueshiba reportedly was doing a lot of research on how to counter judo and "Kito-ryu" - (the exact meaning of what is meant by the latter is unknown, as far as the West is known - Kito-ryu as a school was already almost extinct - I've dealt with that a little in HIPS). From then, according to his students, Ueshiba was apparently "aikifiying" everything - as Sugino quotes him, "In aiki we do it this way." So in short, if the accounts are correct, we have: Ueshiba doing martial arts - somewhat - and getting to be a really strong man Meets Takeda Sokaku - learns Takeda's jujutsu and probably some aiki Ayabe - r-e-a-l-l-y learns aiki and TRAINS - (remember, this is the guy practicing with his spear in the garden and stabbling so deeply in a cheery tree that they had to cut off the spear shaft and leave the spear head in the trunk of the three). Continued training with Takeda on an intermittent and increasingly fraught basis for another 15 or so years - AND studies countering judo. Increasing study of weapons - not enrolling in schools - auditing at best, and mostly observing - and "aikifying" it. Increasingly making (his) aiki(do) his own - combining all the while with his spiritual pursuits - so, by post war, his art was his own method, with an individualized way of training for power. Oh yeah - Mark points out that it is impressive the "little" amount of time it took for him to improve - not twenty years. Part of that is surely talent. But I think we should count in minutes of training, not years. And then, make it - minutes of REAL training. Best Ellis Amdur Last edited by Ellis Amdur : 09-20-2009 at 07:37 PM.
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