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Old 08-09-2011, 03:35 PM   #32
rroeserr
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 27
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Re: The Descent of Aiki

Quote:
Mike Sigman wrote: View Post
????? What? Noticed what? Examples of logical fallacies????? None of that paragraph makes sense to me.
You noticed my straw man and attacked it. I thought it would fun to post roughly the inverse of what you were saying because I knew you would attack it. Like I said you can't have a logical argument if you use fallacies.

Quote:
Mike Sigman wrote: View Post
Judo is very clearly a "deterioration" of originally qi and jin usage, though.
Even Shioda named Judo as an art that lost the skills. Are you indicating that Judo uses a cross-body mode of movement?
Judo does seem to have lost it's internal skills? But at some point in time people with skills created the throws and there is a pattern. The pattern doesn't match pooling noodling front/back open/close.

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Mike Sigman wrote: View Post
Are you saying the Aikido in reality uses "cross body" movement?
Nope.

Quote:
Mike Sigman wrote: View Post
Let me try to make something clear for a second. "Qi" or "Ki" has everything to do with the way the human body moves (and attendant health and all that, but let's keep this simple). In other words, Qi/Ki could be looked at, in a rough sense, as something to do with Thomas Myers' book "Anatomy Trains" (he got the idea from the qi-theory). Except that Myers' view is more or less passive and doesn't really deal with active manipulation of the body, so he didn't get into the dantien part. So the Qi theory would be a sort of "Anatomy Trains" plus the part of the body that is the motivating central nexus, the dantien. It's how the body works when you look at "strength" as some combination of muscles and fascia working together. There are optimal ways to move, given the configuration of the system and that's got a lot to do with why the whole qi/ki thing achieved quasi-religious significance for thousands of years.
Not arguing this. I'm saying that it is possible to use whole body movement driven by the dantien where you have a preference for not moving by opening/closing front/back together.

Quote:
Mike Sigman wrote: View Post
OK, so you're positing a "Japanese Way" of moving the system, instead, it seems. Is it really a "Japanese Way" or is it some devolution or variation of the original whole qi theory?
This is a logical fallacy called begging the question. If you want to have a clinical discussion shouldn't use logical fallacies.
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