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Old 02-15-2007, 11:57 AM   #569
George S. Ledyard
 
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Dojo: Aikido Eastside
Location: Bellevue, WA
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,670
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Re: Baseline skillset

Quote:
Dan Harden wrote:
Could you show me anywhere where he didn't?
There are many, many, interviews and quotes where men have gone on record stating they didn't have a freakin clue what he was talking about and couldn't wait for him to shut up so they could train.
There is significant president in interviews and film where he spent significant time having men push on him. No tenkan, no turn, direct force back into the pusher. Add the countless hours solo training.
It's fairly obvious by the thousands who have no clue about what he was really doing that "finding it" through techniques is stupid. It has never, and will never, work. I find it interesting that the grandsons of Takeda are- right now- purportedly training these skills, instead of the waza based pretzel-logic you seem to advocate as a better method. I wonder why?
Dan
I have to say that I come firmly on Dan's side in this. I constantly meet folks who have trained seriously and consistently for decades who simply don't have any real understanding of what our teachers are doing. The idea that simply repeating the same movements over and over will magically result at some unspecified time in the proper skills is just wrong in most cases.

The training that has been the most helpful to me has been principle based exercises, not waza. Ushiro Sensei does this a lot. Kuroda Sensei did this almost exclusively at the Expo. At least 50 % of Systema training is along these lines.

Static training in Aikido should be used for this but many folks miss the point and simply make it a contest about whose technique is stronger. If done properly, it is about developing the proper "feel" for your technique; conditioning your body to understand what it needs to be doing without the tension created by concerns for timing, spacing, etc. I once attended a seminar with Angier Sensei in which we did what I would call kosa dori sumi otoshi from a static position for a day and a half. Many of the folks attending lost interest and stood around talking but the real "goods" were right in front of them and they didn't see it. They just wanted to mambo...

Dan is absolutely right that most folks don't realize how much training O-Sensei did alone, both in terms of what we would see as spiritual practice and what we would describe as physical training. The fact is that these two areas weren't really separate. Nevertheless, very little of what he did in his solo practice is presented as important as daily training for most people in Aikido. Folks may have this or that exercise presented in class once in a while but not as something that should be done every day and often only in a very abbreviated form.

Saotome Sensei used to do the rowing exercise for a half hour or more every day. One poster commented that he gets bored if he is asked to do it more than a few minutes in class... he wants to get to the waza. He is missing something very important.

Very few people that I see get to a high level of skill just by doing daily partner training comprised of just waza. Some may do so but not any where near as many as should do so. Aikido people need to get out more. There are some absolutely amazing folks out there who can help us tremendously. Since they do principle based training, you do not have to abandon your Aikido. You can train with these people and the application of what they are doing is immediately apparent in ones own technique.

George S. Ledyard
Aikido Eastside
Bellevue, WA
Aikido Eastside
AikidoDvds.Com
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