Thread: Defining Kokyu
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Old 12-24-2005, 02:06 PM   #176
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
Re: Defining Kokyu

Dan Harden wrote:
Otherwise all the belly-breathers would be some major martial people- which they are not.

Hmmmmm. "Ki" is about breathing. Kokyu doesn't have to be about breathing, but you never develop much power in kokyu without the breath training. I don't know of any great Asian martial artists that were NOT breathers, Dan.

Never said they were the same. and you can call the methods and results whatever you wish. And if you are inferring all great asian martial artists are just belly or diaphram breathers...... you would be wrong. There is more to it than that. And since you know that it is true..... it leaves your statement to speak for itself.

Motion in stillness and stillness in motion is a staple of some schools of Daito ryu.

Strange, it's a common thing in Chinese martial arts... the exact same thing. Yet you say DR is purely Japanese!!!




Actually.and for about the fourth time I have told you (why aren't you hearing me?)
1. I was open to considering that it all came from China when we first talked on this topic
2. Then after reading more I said I now believe it did come frm China
3. Then we discussed its influence on Ueshiba-with me stating that much of what ueshiba was talking about was in fact in Daito ryu all along.
4.You just didn't know about it.

Case in point was the stick push and/or manipualtion work. Work which has a photographed, and documented hereitage through Takeda to Sagawa to Kodo and Ueshiba. Something which really isn't open for debate..Its simply there. Whether it was widely known or not really doesn't matter. and assuming he got "it" from purely chinese origins is erroneous. Stan addresses this well and dismissed the Chinese idea through his excellent research. Which should lead you back to considering DR as a source ... or maybe not.
How complete or encompassing the internal work of two schools of DR who have it as compared to Chinese stuff I don't know-but then again -neither do you.....yet Honest and earnest researchers will leave that door open for further exploration.

Personally, I think you're misunderstanding what the breathing is about, Dan, but that's just my opinion.

Well thats declarative. So I will give you another option
Maybe you are not fully understanding me. Maybe I have not been forth coming, but then neither are you.
Tell me what you do that is the declarative "the breathing."

What I do with breathing has little to do with just using the typcial relaxation, abdominal breathing thing, although its a part and sometimes its opposite to what many would think to do voluntarily-though they do in fact do it at times. The belly-breathing limitations comment was obvious for most people reading. Other things are more like breathing with your whole body. I tried to explain this to you once with what I do with a massage technique and how we use it against punching and kicking. Something which at least one reader here knows I do from last year. And I won't go into any detail of what I call loading....

Merry Christmas and.good luck in your training.

I opened that file showing the squating exercise. You should know that there are core trainig exercises that echo these for deep squats
One of which and I am practically quoting....
is to keep the back line straight, the tail bone tucked in and your head up. Lift one leg and extend it in front of the other. balance on your foot and let the quads take the load as you squat. Sink to the floor till you think you will fall down and extend your arms out. let your arm extension make you balance so you don't fall. lift and settle while keepin the knee and shin as straight as possible have to do them on a stair or one of those step aerobic thingy's, otherwise your heel on the extended leg hits the floor
I can tell you that no one I know can do these with anything more than 10lb weights. They kill me!!
I don't think they have a clue as to what other benefits are derived from it. I was intrigued by something you said about tension which I will P.M. you on. I think it is related to what I call loading. I reffered to one of these earlier as a method I do as a "sneezing" example with stick.

Last edited by DH : 12-24-2005 at 02:20 PM.
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