Thread: "Muto"
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Old 03-04-2005, 10:11 PM   #17
David Humm
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 269
United Kingdom
Re: "Muto"

Kent Enfield wrote:
Which style of iai do you study? On the website you give as your homepage, there's batto-ho listed, but without any references to style or lineage. Is that what you're referring to by iai, or do you study something else as well? From what I remember of a thread over at e-budo, you don't actually do iaido, but use "iai" to refer to what you do as part of your aiki-ken.
I studied Muso Shinden Ryu through the BKA (British Kendo Association) albeit disjointed study due to the distance I had to travel to the dojo which later closed because the building housing the dojo burned down. I later continued my study through the aikido organisation to which I belong (having several BKA Yudansha within it) As I explained (when asked) on the e-budo site, My interest in Iai/batto is purely from a development of aikido. I do not at present have an Iai Sensei closer than 130 miles to me and thus I am simply continuing to train using the skills previous taught and applied to aikido. This is why there is no mention of grades or lineage on my website. I claim nothing. (despite being aggressively questioned via PM by one over zealous individual)

Because in your article you wrote:
There are styles wherein the intention is not "to bring the sword very quickly back to one's centre." I was pointing out that though, yes, that is one possibility, there are others. At least the way I read what you wrote, you limit yourself to the one. That is the implicit assumption I disagree with.
Ok conceded however, as I've stated before, this document wasn't intended as definitive material, and I'm certainly not qualified to attest as such.
...I was responding to this:
in which I thought you were assuming that a sword needs to be raised in order to be brought to bear.
That isn't the case, in the context of the translated material suggests that the safest place to enter is "under" the tsuka correct? thus at some point the tsuka must be raised having been drawn from the saya.
...It doesn't need to be raised if it's already raised, a la jodan.
How does it get to jodan if it hasn't be raised at some point ? (lol) and my point being that if the sword is already at jodan at the point when muto dori is required, it would be very unsound of a person to attempt to close maai. I approached the article and the training accompanying it, from the perspective of giving the students "half" a chance of closing maai whilst the sword was brought from chudan to jodan.
I am confused by this statement. Could you please rephrase it for me? In usual usage, kesa giri refers to a downwards diagonal cut, almost always to one going from cutter's right to left, and usually to one starting at the target's shoulder. You cannot make such a cut without the sword being raised, whether prior to the cut are as part of the same action.
I attempted (poorly obviously) to make the same point you made "ala jodan".
I can only think of two reasons for drawing your sword as part of, rather than prior to, an engagement. One is that you are not the one initiating the engagement. I.e. it is a self defense situation. The other is that you are trying to generate surprise attack in order to catch the other person with his sword undrawn. If the other person doesn't have a sword, the benefits of having a drawn sword far outweigh those of launching a surprise attack from close distance.
and now we discuss semantics, my article was a generalism to which you wish to add specifics.
That and the fact that I've not seen tachi-dori in aikido demonstrated against an attack from the draw were the reasons for my assumption.
So by this reasoning the method does not exist? Because you've not seen it.
Like I wrote above, I think the article is pretty good overall. I was just pointing out what I saw to be two implicit assumptions that aren't necessarily true, the removal of one of which would actually help your point.
Kent, many thanks for your comments, I always appreciate constructive criticism, I am however somewhat defensive after being all but accused of Iai fraud via e-budo despite the fact that I've been very careful (and honest) to ensure I haven't made any claims about my experience in Iai. I apologise if this defensiveness appears/appeared aggressive.


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