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Old 10-11-2004, 08:38 AM   #47
L. Camejo
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Dojo: Ontario Martial Arts
Location: Mississauga, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,423
Re: Kotegaishi weakness?

If someone puts said mish mash in front of me I will give my views when appropriate.
Of course this is based on the assumption that you can identify a mish mash when it is placed before you by someone who has been training for a much longer period of time. I don't know what your definition of it may be, but unless one has trained very far and wide in Aikido there are a lot of things that some may look at and say "That is not Aikido", when in fact it very well might be. It's all a matter of perception imo. There are a couple techniques that I have executed in other dojos that people have not seen before in their style of Aikido and ask me the question. In my opinion it depends on what you call Aikido, but this does not mean that this is the only definition of Aikido.

Daren Sims wrote:
To refocuss on this thread I stand my view that pain is not key to kotagaeshi but the blending of movement to draw uke form his centred position into Toris centred position is.
I agree that pain is not the only key to kotegaeshi, I tend to prefer balance breaking and it's effect on joint to body manipulation and control to get the technique working. I think I remember Shioda saying something about this regarding using the wrist to affect the knees via the torso and as a result Tori's structure, to get an effective kotegaeshi. I believe this concept is propagated in Shodokan as well, with a healthy dose of kuzushi just before doing the wrist fold.

I've always been interested on the word "blending" when used in the context of Aikido technique, it can mean many things sometimes.

In my view I always saw the movement to draw Uke into Tori's centre as a combination of correct Tai Sabaki and Kuzushi in that order. I've found that when one simply blends with the incoming atttack without taking Uke off balance the muscular resistance encountered is pretty much the same as if Tori is standing up straight and tensing his wrist as indicated earlier.

I've seen both Aikido and Jujutsu teachers make this mistake when executing the kotegaeshi where they enter to the outside and apply atemi as an elbow to the ribs by turning, just before they turn in the opposite direction to execute the actual kotegaeshi. During the strike to the ribs/back however, Uke tends to be still in balance, allowing him to just stand there and resist the technique by tensing the wrist. Balance disruption is key for kotegaeshi to work, otherwise all you have is an overly helpful and compliant Uke. May be good for first learning the technique, but terrible for applying the technique under resistant conditions.

Just my thoughts.

Last edited by L. Camejo : 10-11-2004 at 08:51 AM.

--Mushin Mugamae - No Mind No Posture. He who is possessed by nothing possesses everything.--
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