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Old 12-13-2000, 07:47 AM   #81
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 168
Re: Re: Re: What Aikido Lacks...

torokun wrote:
Magma: First I'd like to say -- great post. I appreciate being able to talk about these things reasonably...

I agree. I enjoy educated discussion much more than the "show-the-hair-on-your-chest my-aikido-is-better-than-yours" sort of debates that have ranged so freely here recently.

torokun wrote:
Magma wrote:
...let's say... but the aiki principles were there, and I WAS still doing aikido.

Yes. That's right
Wow. Wish I could just stop right there!

but basically in my post, I was referring to "aikido" as a martial system that in general teaches certain techniques and uses certain methods of training.

Yes, this is true. I guess, as you pointed out, the focus is on the fundamentals. That maybe if some level of mastery is gained over the principles involved, those principles can be applied to any situation. Though I am in a fortunate (unfortunate?) situation where one night a week of my aikido training is set aside by my sensei as instruction on more "applied" technique than basic technique. While this does bridge over into arts outside of aikido, I still see the principles at work that we work on the rest of the week.

Maybe it's just that the teachers I mention above never explicitly talked about these things. But why not? You mention Ikeda Sensei's video -- I haven't seen the iriminage one yet, but I would be surprised if it is as you say, since I've never heard of Ikeda Sensei teaching this in class. Why not?

That surprises me. I have not had the fortune or chance to train with Ikeda Sensei, so I cannot speak to this. Perhaps someone else who has could volunteer information on how much emphasis Ikeda Sensei (or other prominent Shihan) place on basics? But then, I think that I have hit on something: I'd more fully expect a Shihan's junior instructors to focus on the basics more than the Shihan him/herself. I'd expect the shihan to help me explore the boundaries of what I know of aikido. Still I'm interested in what people have to say about the various Shihans they have seen.

This is great, but since I don't know where you train, and I've never seen a dojo practice these things regularly, I'm still convinced that this is not very common in aikido...

I train in West Michigan, and get to seminars often in Chicago. In fact there are seminars completely devoted to this sort of training. If you are seriously interested, I suggest you check it out.


And as for strikes being practiced separately... they are. I've been in classes of suburi where that is all we do with maybe one technique the whole night.

You mean open hand strikes? Wow. I've never been in a class like that. Never. Now, I think that's great. But I still don't think that this is common in the art.

No, it is not common. And yes, those were open hand strikes... and kicks. I do TKD as well, and even I would get tired of a class of JUST hand strikes.

I think we are talking the same language, Torokun. If you are ever in the area, look my dojo up and come train. We'll have fun.

It's a sad irony: In U's satori, he forgot every technique he ever knew; since then, generations of doka have spent their whole careers trying to remember.
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