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Old 10-17-2013, 04:40 AM   #21
Rupert Atkinson
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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Re: "IP/IT/IS" vs technique?

Ellis Amdur wrote: View Post
Too much is made of Ueshiba - or Takeda - being beyond technique. There is rarely a moment in any film of Ueshiba where he is doing anything that is not a technique - ikkyo, iriminage, what-have-you. At no moment does he look like he's doing anything other than aikido. Just like all the "technique-oriented aikidoka" that are so fashionable to deride, Ueshiba trots out the same 12 or so techniques almost every moment he's on the mat. When he wants to show off, he pulls out some other Daito-ryu techniques that he hadn't taught anyone post-war.

Seriously, when Ueshiba was talking about being beyond technique, every account comes down to him doing something, and a student asking, "how did you do that?" and him making some grandiose statement, and doing it another way Not some chaotic whirlwind - he just did variations.

Takemusu aiki is really an expression that meant "spontaneous technique," not "no technique." When Ueshiba did Takemusu aiki - it still looked like ikkyo and tenchinage and all the limited rest of the curriculum.

Ellis Amdur
I have to agree, though my thought differs slightly. I think that at first we learn the 10 or so basic techniques. Then we practice them ... a lot. Then we have to break free from them and experiment ... a lot, and perhaps throw in a lot of other stuff. And then, we 'find a way' or we 'construe a way' to perform those same 10 or so shapes in a new way such that they are more spontaneous and less technique. Does that even make sense I wonder?

But at the end of the day, the 10 or so shapes Ueshiba left us are pretty broad basic movements that pretty much cover the totality of the way the body twists and bends - especially in terms of the sword (no leg locks for example). Even though I have done Judo, Jujutsu, Wing Chun, wrestling or whatever, those 10 shapes are everywhere. To me, it is as though Ueshiba just started chucking his students around in 1930 and just kept at it, all the time whittling away his waza until left with the elemental few come 1960. And maybe - we need to travel that same journey to figure it all out ourselves. No wonder we are all in different places!

Last edited by Rupert Atkinson : 10-17-2013 at 04:44 AM.

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