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Old 12-26-2012, 09:02 PM   #19
Chris Li
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Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,300
Re: Double standards

Tom Verhoeven wrote: View Post
I did not define "shisetsu" as "samurai integrity". It is a direct quote from the Shido Yoron, that includes a translation of the word shisetsu.
I never said that you defined it that way, I said:

you cited a post defining "shisetsu" as "samurai integrity"
Which seems to be pretty much the same thing that you repeated above. Did you read my reply?

Tom Verhoeven wrote: View Post
My point was that having a double standard means a lack of integrity. The quote from the Shido Yoron was an illustration, an example of an expression that reflects the point that I had made.

It was not the beginning of an explanation or an argumentation on the ethics of Samurai in any historic period.
Well, the original post specifically cited double standards in conversations relating to Aikido and Budo. You cited a passage specifically citing integrity as relating to the samurai. Can you see how the connection would be naturally assumed in the context of the conversation?

As to double standards and integrity - I don't see anywhere that we've disagreed about that, but I'm not sure what point the original poster is really trying to make, and I said as much several posts ago:

Going back to the original post - I'll agree that double standards are not usually a nice idea, does anyone really disagree with that? But of course, since people may disagree about whether double standards are being applied or not, without a specific example the question is kind of meaningless...
What I'd really like is a clarification from the original poster - I have my own ideas about what is being implied, but I'd rather have them state it straight out.

Tom Verhoeven wrote: View Post

I mean this in a serieus and sincere way; since I joined Aikiweb earlier this year, I have been reading quite a few of your posts. I get the impression that you desparately want to be right, no matter what - but you do not always have your facts right. Worse then that, you all too often come up with invalid argumentation or arguments that are completely of the mark, like in this discussion. You may want to ignore my advice, but personally I think it would be worth your while to make an effort to learn the skill of argumentation (for it is a skill).

If you want my advice, I would say to stay away from what you perceive are my personal flaws and stick to the discussion of what was said, as I have.

Otherwise I'll have to get started on what I perceive as your personal flaws, and the places where you don't have your facts right, and we'll never get anywhere.



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