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Old 10-21-2012, 01:59 AM   #183
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 815
United Kingdom
Re: VoE: AWASE - The Principle of AIKI

Christopher Li wrote: View Post
I didn't say anything about fibbing (that was in reference to a different passage, but I didn't say "fibbing" there, either), I said that it's impossible to tell from the context exactly what he meant by "correct". If you are of the opinion that mimicking his outer form at all times is the way to go then that's fine, but I differ.
Indeed. You did say something about people making their own minds in the context of the discussion of the photo. It was Ernesto Lemke and you earlier, who said:

"That would be Shirata per Stevens then. There is no reference that is a direct quote."
"It could be that is what he was told, or what he heard from another source (he was friendly with Saito, for example). "
"...I'm mostly pointing out that it's not a given (in the sense that it's not all that clear) to me that it is Shirata's view that is represented here. For instance, Stevens added a short biography of the Founder to the book which surely contains information that came via Shirata but is as much the product of Stevens' own research (IOW via other sources then Shirata). In other parts of the book Stevens sometimes mentions quite clearly when passages are either a summary of or references to Shirata's point of view. Regarding hanmi I don't find such a reference so it's left open to debate."

It seems that the only reason for you to discard this specific information (other that it doesn't fit with your views) is that it could be Stevens and not Shirata who was saying that - that despite of Shirata posing in hanmi on the same and preceding pages.

I will ignore the "at all times" which I didn't say and will ask you this:

1. If the "outer form" demonstrated by the founder is not important, why insist on not doing it?
2. How you decide when to stop "mimicking his outer form"? Will you have all the --kyo, shihonage, koshinage, kokyunage etc... reworked to their non outer form shape? If so, how will your martial art look like when you are done?
3. In the context of the previous question, how does your Aikido look like now? How would you categorise your linage?

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