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Old 05-28-2012, 11:13 PM   #111
graham christian
Dojo: golden center aikido-highgate
Location: london
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,697
Re: Spiritual and i/p

Hugh Beyer wrote: View Post
Graham, you've made a bunch of points recently which I agree with--particularly in the post about judgement--so I thought I'd celebrate by arguing with you.

Absolutely. The IS/IP skills have nothing directly to do with the spiritual aspects of Aikido. (Except, perhaps, that "HULK SMASH!" is not good budo.)

Yes indeedy.

Speaking on behalf of the entire IS/IP community, I declare no one would say that spiritual equals ineffective. Mostly because we'd be too busy arguing your terms, but never mind.

Oh crud, you were doing so well. This is where I think your argument runs off the rails. If you want to declare your aikido has leads to better spiritual growth than pursuing IS skills, that would be one thing. If you want to say it's more "effective"--I'm assuming martially effective, because that's the only interpretation which makes sense--then you're making a very serious claim which others are fully justified in challenging. And which you can only support by showing it in person.

On the other hand, I don't disagree with you on the subject of the spiritual dimension of O-Sensei's Aikido. I think it's clear that was important to him and an important part of his message--and an important part of what attracts people to Aikido. When he called in an "Art of Peace"--in post-war Japan--I think it was a clear and heartfelt ambition.

What I don't agree with is the idea that being focused on peace means that we all make nice. The Art of Peace is the art of the sword--as when Jesus said, "I come not to bring peace, but a sword." It's the sword that cuts through the lies and delusions, through the layers of appeasement, through the hypocrisy and politics and make-nice. It cuts through to the center, to the knot that keeps everyone bound--and it doesn't stop to untie it, but simply cuts it apart. That clarity of vision and singleness of action is, IMHO, the true budo. And it's what, at best, I think we should be trying to practice on the mat.

It is not. What does that even mean, anyway? The current situation in Syria is good? Global warming is good? Circular arguments on AikiWeb are good? It's feel-good noise.
Brilliant. I commend you. Ha, ha.

Shame about the oh crud bit though.

I do say it is effective martially and always have. Therefor it is effective 'against' I/P. and physical. It's seen by you as an argument , fair enough. It's not an argument from my perspective.

It's not 'serious' either, it's natural. I'm never or hardly ever serious. It doesn't equal challenge either unless you think martial arts is some kind of cowboy thing. I don't accept challenges any more. Been there, done that, waste of time. It's an ego thing.

That doesn't mean I can't teach most anyone. Two different things.

I'm glad you don't agree with the art of peace means we all make 'nice'. Nor do I. Harmony is different to nice. That's pretty much how I teach the sword too. True budo? Couldn't agree more. What we should at best be practicing on the mat? Indeed.

So as they say in the advert whassssssup? I agree. It's only your false view of spiritual which leads you to assume I do different.

It's all good means I understand where you are coming from and where others are coming from and where I am coming from and with that understanding and acceptance it's all good. Debating without slandering each other or our mothers, it's all good. Look for the good and you'll begin to like it.