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Old 12-07-2011, 01:18 PM   #46
graham christian
Dojo: golden center aikido-highgate
Location: london
Join Date: Oct 2010
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Re: "Irimi" by Ellis Amdur

Quote:
Kevin Leavitt wrote: View Post
Jon Reading wrote:

It is my definition too.

You made me think of something that has not been addressed. The concept of "pre-emptive strike".

Really I think this is a very related issue and one that centers heavily around ethics and the ethical employment of force.

For me, irimi is not pre-emptive. pre-emptive means you are attacking uke before he attacks you. As most of us know the doctrine of pre-emptive strike employed by the U.S. in Iraq has been a source of controversy.

So, if I enter into nage and disrupt him (attack) before he attacks I think it is one set of ethics. If I respond when he attacks another....I think this concept is covered well in the Oscar O'ratti book dealing with the four possible scenarios of attack.

When Graham discusses moving behind uke by moving off the line before uke attacks...I see this as pre-emptive. Of course, what you do once you achieve this position affects the ethics of the situation, but the fact is...you have done SOMETHING that uke must now react to in some way. I would say, for most situations in which he felt threatened and exposed, it will serve to escalate the situation.

Is that good or bad? I think it depends, but at the base level YOU did something that caused Uke to respond.

On the other hand, if Uke moves first and attacks, and I respond...well then it might be different even though the outcome ends up the same.

I am not saying what is right or wrong...only that we need to consider all the factors that go into the situations we might find ourselves in.
When you pre-emptively move off line and arrive 'behind' it cannot actually escalate the situation. You would have to feel it to know why but I'll put it this way. You would have to imagine yourself as the attacker and just as your committing the opponent is there close but 'behind' you, possibly with a knife to your throat. End of play.

Now if I remove the knife to throat bit the same applies. You automatically know you're done for. You have already lost. The nage is in total control by position ready to end it and boy you know it. You know it's finished, over, done. No escalation is possible. That's the whole point of irimi in the first place.

Regards.G.
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