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Old 11-02-2011, 12:49 PM   #79
Basia Halliop
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 711
Canada
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Re: Being overly complacent as Uke

Maybe we're misunderstanding each other in part, but it's possible we may also partly disagree.

I don't actually think you have an exceptional ability, by the way, I just think it wouldn't matter one way or another if you do. The reason I said that was because I understood you to be implying that it's OK to override someone's clearly communicated choice if you know better than them. I was using exaggeration to disagree -- i.e., there is no level of excellence I can imagine which would give someone that right. If that's not what you were actually arguing, then sorry for misunderstanding.

Certainly, what someone is trying to communicate matters. E.g., in the case of the old lady, she's not in any way asking you to 'let go of her', and it's quite reasonable to suspect that she in fact probably hopes you won't, so clearly you should not do so (at least not without asking her to clarify and being quite sure that's what she wants). She's just saying 'something's wrong', so you stop and figure out what's wrong and what she wants you do to or not do. That I certainly agree with.

If they're not telling you to let go of them, if that's not what tapping means in your dojo, then sure, it's different. If they just mean 'stop increasing the pressure', then stop increasing the pressure. And of course much communication can be non-verbal - you can communicate a lot with a pause or a raised eyebrow.

All I insist on is that if they ARE clearly communicating a choice to you (e.g., stop putting on the pressure, stop touching me, don't do that again, whatever it is that they're telling you), then you have no right to go against their choice, regardless of whether their choice is a poor choice or a good choice or even just a silly choice. (although you are of course free to try to change their mind). Several of your posts gave me a strong impression that you don't fully agree with this principle. If that's not what you meant, then perhaps we don't actually disagree.

Certainly, I think we agree that you need to look at the situation and see what's actually being communicated and make sure you and uke are on the same page. No disagreement there.

The 'someone trying to kill you' example is spurious, IMO. We are not talking about situations where your own safety is in danger.

Quote:
Earlier in the thread, you scoffed at someone for using personal experiences to support a point of view. But examples and personal experiences are a lot more concrete than generalities and platitudes.
Yes, sometimes it's easier to see what someone really means with an example.
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