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Old 07-12-2011, 01:34 PM   #26
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
Re: Non-Aikido thoughts and considerations

Jonathan Wong wrote: View Post
Hi Dan-
Ultimately your post covers both sides pretty well. I just meant: Takeda didn't exactly spend time in a library studying the "classics," right? His life just wasn't like that. He grew up in pretty messed-up circumstances.
Whereas, Ueshiba really did grow up comfortable and reading this type of stuff.
Presumptions abound don't they?
Ueshiba spent what years studying what classics that infused his body method?
When he was traveling all over the place as he was want to do?
He fell apart and cowered in tears when he met Takeda.
He fell apart against the Military guys six years later after having trained many times with Takeda.
It wasn't till after a day to day intensive study at Ayabe that he was known for power. So, was it curiously that during that time he got it from reading the classics and not from Takeda? And were that true where are the others who got it from the classics?....crickets again.
ere is another cricket response to a question.
Takeda trained under some scolars as well. But never the less we hear the argument that the knowledge of the classics was all over that knowledge skipped Takeda after immersion in the Tradional arts just how?
He demonstrated a deep physical understanding for years prior to Training Ueshiba
Yet with that we know for sure that he didn't get the relation of his own skills to the classics just why?
Ueshiba stated that "Takeda opened my eyes to true budo" (That did not include the knowledge of understanding the classics why?

Takeda successfully taught royalty and many upper cless Japanese, as well as many Koryu teachers, as well as Admirals and generals in the military and dozens of police departments, yet was somehow unrefined and ignorant? If you know anything about Japanese history, that is highly unlikely.
I am not taking away from Ueshiba either. I am sure Ueshiba grew on his own and explored other methods, later. Curiously though, we do not see, certain significant changes I would be looking for were he heavily influenced by Chinese methods.

Anyway I think the best evidence we have for the way info was organized in Takeda's mind (and what info was there, period) is as you say-- we have to look at the info in the extant branches and look at what is conserved across that diversity. It's still speculation, and the biggest problem is indeed:
how to separate what was not known from what was kept secret. Ultimately that could only be guessed at from body movement and usage.
You will have a very tough time with that. Even as late as this year some interesting information came to light tying things together. It all depends on who you know and what you can demonstrate that opens certain doors. Certain parts of both arguments are spot on, though there are twists to the points that are not expressed here. Not that any of it matters much.
Information is a good thing, actual skill and information better, having both and being able to teach, better yet. No matter what though, it is the work that matters.
In the fullness of time the hard work and who may be up to it or not remains to be seen.
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