View Single Post
Old 07-08-2011, 10:37 AM   #22
graham christian
Dojo: golden center aikido-highgate
Location: london
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,697
Re: Terms: I.S., I.P., Neijin, Fajin, Aiki, etc.

Jonathan Wong wrote: View Post
But the fact is he said and , rather than specifically chosing "harmonize" instead of "combine" or "merge" or any other English term. The folks you mention translated as they did, that I will not argue, and there must have been some reason for the 10th dan rank promotions. But Tohei openly dismissed the way O-sensei presented his thoughts (in terms of kami, etc. see his interviews), so are we really entertaining the idea that Tohei fully respected the intricacies of the religious overtones in O-sensei's lectures? Combined with the famous "when I look back, no one is following me" comment from O-sensei, I do think it remains to be demonstrated if anyone ever has really understood and interpreted for us the entirety of what O-sensei said. Point being-- I don't see any one english term being correct when translating terms like aiki.

But... this is the non-aikido forum. The terms in the OP are the point. Mike, "aiki" and "IP" are the only terms in your list that are not directly related to Chinese (or older) usage. I get conceptually how aiki fits, but is there any direct link just in terms of terminology?
The folks translated as they did because they were there and understood the context and tones with which he was speaking so you cannot get better, plus they trained with him and were entrusted to do so by him.

You can search for something that someone ie: Tohei, dismissed and try to use that to serve some idea if you like and then everyone can say 'even Tohei said' How silly can you get.

It wasn't Toheis way of presentation. Tohei was not of that religion. So it's obvious rather than an example. The one connecting factor that led Tohei, Hikitsuchi and others TO understand him was that they did a spiritual practice.

There's one famous teacher who explains quite clearly the reasons why he and others couldn't understand what O'Sensei was on about and says it was because of the time difference and not knowing or understanding the old religious tales etc. He then goes on to say he finally understood only after studying zen, a spiritual activity. Others will know of whom I speak as I can't remember exactly who that was.

It's not a matter of translating a word literally it's a matter of understanding conceptually. To understand conceptually you thus have to increase your spiritual awareness.

  Reply With Quote