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jonreading · 09-30-2010, 02:51 PM

Wow, only 85 posts and we have the 2010 politically popular rhetoric of "Islamophobia." I guess calling other posters racist didn't fit the bill because we're talking religion. Of course, claiming someone is afraid of Islam "Islam-phobia" is also pretty ridiculous since clearly no one on any of these posts is claiming to be afraid of Islam.

If anything, I think some posters have raised the question that a post (or more) was insensitive of Islam; prove it. Cite the post, air the facts, and tell that person why you believe their comments were insensitive. As my marriage counselor says, start with "I feel" instead of "you did." Jun will kick the poster's butt and we'll all move on (sorry Jun).

It has somehow become popular of late to use personal prejudice as a valid retort in the course of an argument, let alone the correct prejudicial label. It's a shame to see yet another thread go down the tubes because we resort to personal attacks.

To quote a section of the original post:
He is a Muslim and will not, because of his precepts and faith, bow to the ground either at the Kamiza or to another when we greet in the Japanese way(In our dojo when in seiza we bow all the way down to the mat to another when we finish the session as a thank you).
Additionally:
Would you allow his freedom to follow his creed and forgo the standard dojo bow and just get on with training or not?

I think the very nature of the question is how much leniency should a dojo demonstrate towards religious doctrine and the expression of religious beliefs within the dojo. A broad question like that should solicit many responses, some more conservative in application and some more liberal. The responses may not be valid, but I think the poster is trying to figure out how to balance the dojo's environment against this student's religious needs. And from there, establish a defensible position to preserve that balance.

I would expect some of our Muslin-country friends should respond with "Our dojo is predominantly Muslim and here's what we do..." on the other hand, some of our little town America friends should respond with something like, "Actually, we see more Christians that have difficulty balancing their faith with class than Muslims, but here's how we handled those situations."

Sorry, I'll climb down now.

09-30-2010, 02:51 PM	#82
jonreading Dojo: Aikido South Location: Johnson City, TN Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,209 Offline	Re: To bow or not to bow Wow, only 85 posts and we have the 2010 politically popular rhetoric of "Islamophobia." I guess calling other posters racist didn't fit the bill because we're talking religion. Of course, claiming someone is afraid of Islam "Islam-phobia" is also pretty ridiculous since clearly no one on any of these posts is claiming to be afraid of Islam. If anything, I think some posters have raised the question that a post (or more) was insensitive of Islam; prove it. Cite the post, air the facts, and tell that person why you believe their comments were insensitive. As my marriage counselor says, start with "I feel" instead of "you did." Jun will kick the poster's butt and we'll all move on (sorry Jun). It has somehow become popular of late to use personal prejudice as a valid retort in the course of an argument, let alone the correct prejudicial label. It's a shame to see yet another thread go down the tubes because we resort to personal attacks. To quote a section of the original post: He is a Muslim and will not, because of his precepts and faith, bow to the ground either at the Kamiza or to another when we greet in the Japanese way(In our dojo when in seiza we bow all the way down to the mat to another when we finish the session as a thank you). Additionally: Would you allow his freedom to follow his creed and forgo the standard dojo bow and just get on with training or not? I think the very nature of the question is how much leniency should a dojo demonstrate towards religious doctrine and the expression of religious beliefs within the dojo. A broad question like that should solicit many responses, some more conservative in application and some more liberal. The responses may not be valid, but I think the poster is trying to figure out how to balance the dojo's environment against this student's religious needs. And from there, establish a defensible position to preserve that balance. I would expect some of our Muslin-country friends should respond with "Our dojo is predominantly Muslim and here's what we do..." on the other hand, some of our little town America friends should respond with something like, "Actually, we see more Christians that have difficulty balancing their faith with class than Muslims, but here's how we handled those situations." Sorry, I'll climb down now.