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Old 05-20-2009, 07:53 AM   #62
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Re: O sensei and 'correct ukemi'

Quote:
Shaun Ravens wrote:
Quote:
Dan Harden wrote:
I think Takeda taught what he knew, Ueshiba knew more than he taught.
As I meditated on your point, it became crystal clear to me that:
A. This couldn't possibly be substantiated as anything more than opinion at best.
I find it hard to believe that you would hold to this position? Perhaps it is just like option "D" that you posted. Something you thought to just throw out there that isn't your opinion, but somewhere, somehow, it could be true?

Going by articles and interviews, we see quite a few things that Takeda supposedly did that Ueshiba didn't show. For example, having someone grab a napkin or paper or whatever and throwing them. (I believe Sagawa has done this.) Having someone grab his (Takeda) neck and throwing them. Using his feet. (Kodo on film doing this). Where is Ueshiba doing these things? One of the few things that are common are some (not all) of the push tests.

In the realm of techniques, it's not hard to research the various schools of Daito ryu and see each using different techniques. The Takumakai supposedly catalogued both Takeda's techniques and Ueshiba's techniques. Looking at the whole, all the Daito ryu schools certainly seem to have quite a bit more techniques than Aikido.

Takeda also taught sword. Ueshiba ... well, we know how that's been talked about.

Fan? Takeda, yes. Ueshiba?

When I read your post and your point "A", it threw me for a loop. I really didn't understand how you could come to this "crystal clear" point in light of a lot of articles and interviews out there.

Speaking of Ueshiba knowing more than he taught. There are interviews talking about how Ueshiba stopped people in their tracks. I'm told it's a Daito ryu thing. But, I can't find any of Ueshiba's students doing this. And it's sort of an unspoken thing that Ueshiba pared down the Daito ryu syllabus when he created aikido.

Perhaps Takeda never taught *all* that he knew. That's certainly a valid theory. However, in light of what Takeda *did* teach to others, it isn't hard to see that Ueshiba knew more than he taught.