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Old 06-11-2008, 09:20 PM   #49
Jonathan
Dojo: North Winnipeg Aikikai
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 242
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Re: The poll on aikido spirituality

Eric:

I wrote:

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Yes, I agree. God does, indeed, define who He is. I believe He has done so, however, in the pages of the Bible.
You wrote:

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And elsewhere ...
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Psalm 19 wrote:
The heavens declare the glory of God;
the skies proclaim the work of his hands.
Day after day they pour forth speech;
night after night they display knowledge.
There is no speech or language
where their voice is not heard.
Their voice goes out into all the earth,
their words to the ends of the world.
I'm not sure if you realize this or not, but in quoting from the Bible here you sort of make my point for me...

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See there it is again. The Word is Christ himself. The text only testifies to the Word, which is EVERYWHERE, in EVERYTHING. By the Word, all things were made, and to which all things in creation therefore rightly testify. Pagans too, if you listen ...and if you listen hard enough WITH them -- they may actually hear it, too ... instead of hearing us go on about "errors."
I don't argue this point, Eric. As I've already said, there are truths that are evident to all people regardless of their religious persuasion (or lack thereof). When I find such a truth presented within the framework of another religion I don't dismiss it as falsehood. At the same time, I don't go so far as to think that God has in some special way (ie via the Holy Spirit) imparted this truth to this other religion with the intent that I should go on some kind of pan-religion- truth-treasure-hunt to find it.

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The only fruit that matters is love. I am interested in relating the two expressions of spirituality properly in the right order, nothing else, but that does not entail rejecting what Ueshiba rightly taught from his Shinto understanding. Ueshiba said that True Budo is Love. John 13: 34-35: ""A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."
While I don't care for the Shinto framework in which Ueshiba placed his value for love and his belief in its power to bring peace among people, I don't dismiss it as a falsehood. In fact, I agree with it insofar as it agrees with the Bible. My problem is with the idea that he is expressing some special truth imparted particularly and uniquely to him by God.

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Coll. 1:23 : "...continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which has been preached to every creature under heaven, ..." To every creature.
Yes, this is what I've just been writing about - those truths that may be perceived by all people. I have never denied that such truth existed universally.

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I presume it must therefore be, to whatever degree, somewhere in Ueshiba's teaching, working its purposes -- to be found if we look for it.
I may find it in Ueshiba's teaching, but I believe I'll find a better rendition in the teachings of Christ, the Creator of the World.

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Since we are all in error, always, what purpose is there in focussing on error -- instead of looking assiduously for the Truth -- which is revealed in all creation as well as in specific scriptural revelation
I believe I have said something of this kind already:

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The best way to recognize a counterfeit is to know the real thing. And one's capacity to share truth doesn't rest upon how conversant one is with falsehood.
See?

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This is the purpose of Aikido -- to awaken in us a love of our enemy and thus to uncover for them and in them the Truth by our own sacrifice, as He loved us -- that is True Budo, and thereby we may make them true disciples of the Law of Love. There is nothing apostate in that.
If by "we" you mean Christians, then I would say that it is a sad state of affairs when a Christian must seek the "awakening" you speak of through a martial art rather than in the way the Bible tells us God intended - through faith in His Son as Saviour and Lord. I would say more on this last quotation of yours, but it would be further wrangling over points of Christian doctrine which even I, at this point, am tiring of.

As Ludwig (aka aikilouis) has indicated, the point of this thread has wandered beyond what is directly pertinent to Aikido. Consequently, I am going to end my discussion of this matter here. If you'd like to continue in private, Eric, feel free to p.m. me.

Thanks for a vigorous and engaging discussion!

"Iron sharpens iron; so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend."
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