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Old 01-14-2008, 07:06 AM   #110
L. Camejo
 
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Dojo: Ontario Martial Arts
Location: Mississauga, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2001
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Re: I'm Leaving Aikido

Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
I announced i was leaving to see if any others had the same feelings as i, and to almost help me as to if i was making the right choice. I'm not stubborn enough to disregard opinions of those who have had much more expierience than me. Of course i want to find other options rather then leaving, i spent two years three times a week.
I agree that you should leave Aikido, or at least whatever Aikido dojo you're studying at now. It is obviously not meeting your needs.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
Wouldn't you want to seek other peoples opinions, who have more expirience than yourself before leaving a martial art??
Actually, no. I would seek information from those more experienced before starting the martial art. When I leave I just leave as the decision has been made.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
some people agreeing with me. Of course i know many people see Aikido as more than a form of self defence and almost a religion or something.
Not sure if you're referring to me here, but it's not a religion for us. In fact we are probably one of the most un-philosophical Aikido methods around. However I will severely question anyone who makes incorrect blanket claims about something that I take very seriously.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
As for the point of my thread, you got it right, the Aikido i have been taught, and the Aikido i have seen. Including countless videos, is not the art for me. It's great self defence when your being attacked on the mat...but i find the Aikido i have seen. (Thousands of videos of dojos all around the world online, about 15 dvd's and Casettes) wouldn't work for real.
Sad that the world of today lets video, tapes and youtube replace what could be found out using common sense (which of course is not so common). Everyone I know, including myself, who have used any martial art or just pure survival instinct to survive when seriously attacked off the mat did not have a camera available at the time to film anything. Many will never know what the dynamics of any of the conflicts were, except for personal reports and evidence of the scars and bruises. Of course these same ones who do not know and have not been there will assume a lot about what training method is or is not good for self defence, regardless of what actually did work. Interesting that. I've personally found Aikido easier to apply in the street since (unlike Uke in the dojo) I really don't worry too much about keeping my attacker safe - that is almost entirely up to him.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
Unless, im finding now, it's drastically different, or other martial art techniques are blended in with that Aikido.
It can be drastically different depending on the school and teacher you train with. From my own experience there are maybe 4 major schools of Aikido that could teach someone to viably defend himself. Within these schools you may find maybe 1 in 10 persons have actually had to use the art in an actual conflict. So the pickings of Aikidoka who are both experienced in and train in a method that is conducive to real world self defence is very slim imho. But when you find them you experience an Aikido that is quite formidable as a combat system and there are no doubts about effectiveness. And no, though many may believe this, one does not need to mix in outside techniques to have it work well. But this is an even rarer creature to find imho. From my own experience one can be trained to defend oneself using Aikido or any other method in a 16-hour weekend course, but the method needs to address issues that are critical to self defence and nothing else.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
Of course many people say "at our dojo we train FOR REAL our techniques work" then that's fine, but then it becomes less about Aikido and much more specific to the instructor who is teaching that Aikido and then..is it Aikido??
You'll find that almost everything about the Aikido you learn comes down to the Instructor. The rest is up to you. Whether it's Aikido or not really depends on whether your Instructor actually knows Aikido and more importantly how to apply its principles to actual combat in this case.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
It's a lot more easier to find something that does what it says on the tin, then hunting down rare dojos who actually teach the kind of Aikido i would be looking for. If it's anything close to what i've been taught or seen, then it's not for me.
From what you have said, the martial Aikido schools will probably not look anything like what you have seen, but they will be Aikido as long as the principles are there. I agree that it is easier to find something that does what is says on the tin. However what no one tells you is that what's in the tin only tastes good if you know how to prepare it well.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
Also harry i have never seen a real punch ever neatrilised by a shinage or yonko etc, ever. And i've watcher a lot of Aikido. Is this traditional Aikido you train in? or something else.
Not sure if you're still talking to me but if you are, the name is Larry.

The thing is one does not attempt to make the technique work on a particular attack (i.e. force the technique upon the attacker), but rather the technique must match the energy and direction of the attack for it to make sense. Shihonage can work with a "real punch" (I'm assuming this to be something like a hook/sucker punch), but that has more to do with how one sets up the waza and breaks the attacker's balance. A lot depends on how you evade the initial attack and then use your new position to break the balance of the attacker and use his momentum to assist your waza. If you're working against his motion then any waza will be difficult.
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
If it is traditional Aikido, then i guess i have been trained wrong. Personally, ive watched a LOT of aikido, and i belive it's as simple as the aikido. It's just not nice to admit it. Took me a while to.
Not sure what you refer to as "traditional". What we do is Shodokan (the "sport" Aikido you referred to) it involves a lot of training against a person who fully resists and fights back, so one quickly learns what works and why it works. As far as "traditional" goes, though we are not Aikikai, the Aikido that we practice is an evolution of what existed in the very early days of Aikido's development (i.e. very similar to Daito Ryu Aikijujtsu as taught by Ueshiba M.)
Quote:
Daniel Ranger-Holt wrote: View Post
And no i didnt start aikido to learn bouncer protection. I decided to become a bouncer about a year and half in. I learned Aikido because something happened for me to want to protect myself. Obviously the job came along and then i thought it would be suited for Aikido. But found personally it wasn't.
My apologies for an incorrect assumption. However I beg you to take a look at the author mentioned in my first post. It may shed some light on things - Bouncer's Guide To Barroom Brawling: Dealing With The Sucker Puncher, Streetfighter, And Ambusher and Real Fighting: Adrenaline Stress Conditioning Through Scenario-Based Training. There is some very good information in those pages regarding working as a bouncer as well as facing real life attacks, regardless of the method you train in. The interesting part is that all of the major bouncers in this book, including the author practice a very martial system of Aikido and other MA.

Regards.
LC

--Mushin Mugamae - No Mind No Posture. He who is possessed by nothing possesses everything.--
http://www.tntaikido.org
http://www.mushinkan.ca
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