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Old 09-05-2007, 01:42 PM   #257
Dojo: Hans de Jong Self Defence School
Location: Perth
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 239
Re: What technique would you apply to neutralize Brazilian Jujitsu attacker

Don Magee wrote: View Post
Judo also has the same goal of mutual welfare and benefit. However, the training methods are not designed for everyone. My fear is that like the "No child left behind Act" in the Unites States, targeting a training method everyone can do means watering down your training to the lowest ability level of the group. When students couldn't pass the tests in high school, to keep funding schools made the tests easier. Without exclusion, you see the same in martial arts.
Judo was originally developed for this goal. That is why it is taught in the school system in Japan. This was Kano's goal, not an Olympic sport, with that type of training.

Don Magee wrote: View Post
That is NOT to say some people should no train. Everyone should train, however, people need to realize they will not always succeed. Not everyone will get a black belt, or even get past their white belt. The encouragement should be to train, everyone can train, even if its only for 5 minutes at the level most judo and bjj clubs train at. The training is for everyone, just everyone might not be successful at it.
I think with the right teacher everyone can succeed.

Don Magee wrote: View Post
In regards to the scientific method, the martial arts are not an exact science. In fact most of our proofs have never been recreated. There is not a single person in aikido today who can do what Ueshiba did. To me this means one of three things.
a) aikdoka of today are training wrong on purpose for some reason.
b) Ueshiba was a poor teacher and did not teach what he knew.
c) The stories were not true.
It would have to be a combination of the three. But that makes the goal no less important. The main problem today, and I think even in the later years of O'Sensei's life, is that you don't get the feeling that the uke is really testing tori, it is mostly a flashy demonstration. When you see footage of Mifune with his partners, you know those guys are trying to throw him, and he moves effetely past them, and then throws them in return. This is how it used to be with O'Sensei. So with consistent hard mindful training, the evidence is still there, Kano, Ueshiba, Mifune, Mochizuki, that it is possible to cultivate the awareness to use simple techniques to overcome an opponent.

Don Magee wrote: View Post
Unlike the feather and the brick, we can not reproduce what Ueshiba was able to do. I can quickly test the feather and brick and find they fall at the same speeds and grow on it. I can quickly test the effectiveness of an armbar and grow on it. But the metaphysical subjects that I am questioning can not be tested. They are more like philosophy or psychology. There is no proof or right answer, unlike an armbar. Also my personal testing in both types of training environments has proven to me there is something lacking in non-sport training that I think is dearly important. This is in direct conflict with Ueshiba. Who is right? Me, Him, probably both. It is not disrespectful to challenge him. I doubt he even cares.
I would not call it metaphysical. This is kind of a cop-out. You can see the physical manifestation. Today I only see it in kendo, were old guys bust out simple flicks and beat down younger faster stronger opponents. But it is there.

The topic of sport or not sport training is highly subjective. To me a sport leads to a competition. A competition leads to a winner. A winner requires a loser. There is nothing mutually beneficial in this situation. I would say that O'Sensei is right. But I track this logic up to the idea of the cold war as Mochizuki Kancho spoke about. If you think about a winning and losing mentality in terms of a war, losing is bad. Ultimately, everyone loses. This is the fact of mutually assure destruction. Plant the seed that it's not okay to lose in a future president's mind, and when it comes time to choose to step down or press the button, there's a chance it won't be good, for the whole world!


Graham Wild
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