Thread: The Leather Man
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Old 07-31-2007, 04:52 PM   #45
David Orange
Dojo: Aozora Dojo
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,511
Re: The Leather Man

Lee Salzman wrote: View Post
... How long has this fascia idea been pushed... a year? For well over a year I would say, if not more. How much practical enlightenment has come of that?
Well, it's been around for hundreds if not thousands of years, but very, very few people have looked into it. First, probably, because it's not obvious and second because their teachers didn't tell them about it. And their teachers didn't tell for reasons previously discussed: the teachers were protecting themselves by not letting just anyone find out about it; and the teachers were protecting the students because training with that system in the wrong way is debilitating to one's health. If you've read much about qigong (used to be called chi kung), they always say you need to have a qualified teacher or you can hurt yourself seriously. And where are the qualified teachers?

Lee Salzman wrote: View Post
The methods for training coordinated strength should be right there, and self-evident, without needing to talk about fascia or qi or ki to use them, or even know about them.'s not all self-evident because it uses "weakness" or at least "softness" in a world oriented to hardness and strength. And maybe saying "coordinated strength" is an example of that orientation. Dan has describe something almost the opposite--in effect, causing the opponent to coordinate his own weakness to the extreme so that he loses all his power. And he does this using both his own and the opponent's fascial system.

Because the fascia system is so different in structure and function from the muscle system (and because so few people even recognize it at all--much less as a whole system), we need to be very careful in how we think about how we might employ it.

Lee Salzman wrote: View Post
But this empirical flavor is missing from the "fascia" idea. So how is it an advancement over simply saying "ki" or "qi"?
I think the empircal element is there in people offering to demonstrate it very openly. Several people have met Dan, Mike and Rob/Akuzawa now and have reported impressive experiences. Dan is reported to be able to stand in an ordinary stance and not only not be pushed over, but make the one pushing him become weak and unable to lift his feet--or make him fall. And he is said to be able to generate tremendous penetrating impact with almost no motion. Likewise for Mike Sigman, according to no less than George Ledyard. And you can see videos of Akuzawa doing some pretty eerie stuff.

So I think the empirical side is covered. The only question is how to do that stuff, ourselves.

And I started this thread to be able to "ruminate" somewhat on that subject, as I shall do more before long.



"That which has no substance can enter where there is no room."
Lao Tzu

"Eternity forever!"
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