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Old 06-04-2007, 01:29 PM   #102
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
Re: Parsing ai ki do

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
A few points. Dan's contention is that few ( if anyone) practice (or seek after) Ueshiba's aiki. I think he is wrong, but let's leave that.
No. I think everyone, or at least most, are in fact hoping to do that very thing. I just think that many, if not most, are running in circles-literally- while doing so.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
The Chinese proverb says that the first step to learning anything is to call it by its proper name. That is what this "parsing aikido" thread is exploring. What we are actually debating in discussing the "name" of anything is not the thing aimed at but the tutoring method.
But you must know the name and what it means in order to enter a debate over it's tutoring method. I claim no expertise, But I contend you do not understand what the name implies.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
Put this in Taoist terms to make the pedagogical point. The Nameless way begets the One, One begets Two, Two begets Three -- and Three begets the Ten Thousand Things. Dan is trying to teach people to learn the One -- directly. An awful big bite for many, many people. It is like the same terms of the Rinzai/Soto debate in different dress. Surely, a lot of "sleepy sitting" is just as useless as "mindless intellectualism" in paradox-wrestling, but the fault lies not in the method -- but the sincerity in doing either one of them
Your very definitions of how I am right or wrong and why I cannot make a definitive statement applies to your own observations about me. Your logic makes it impossible for anyone to discuss anything definitively. It renders all discussion meaningless.

No one, not one "needs to learn through ten thousand techniques"
Anyone and everyone can clearly learn to approach the art from the source or from "the one" as you call it. In truth it is the only way to approach it. Whether you start from there or learn it backwards like most –if and when you start to get it –you got it from understanding you and your body well. Not from anything you ever did to anyone by blending. Otherwise you never got it and were just blending for your whole life
And I and others can get you there faster and more efficiently then any of these waza laden methods.
Erick Mead wrote: View Post
Problem is, most people are stuck on the phenomenal perception of events -- the Ten Thousand things. Dan criticizes the teaching of many, many techniques as a distraction from the direct route up the face of the cliff, going -- as he says -- the "wrong way."

His problem is in assuming that all people start the problem from the same position or with the same relative impediments to learning. That simply is not the case. He mistakes the purpose of techniques as embodiments (phenomena) as being about themselves. In fact, they are ultimately to be discarded, but are not useless per se, even if meant to be superseded along with the phenomenal perspective they represent.
I make no assumptions about where folks are when they come to me. I simply share with them what I do. For some stragner reason it seems to instanly change the way they think and move. THe approach to the problem hets resolved very quickly as they all- for some strange reason- see where the arts, all become one. Inside them
And you my friend have not been privy to the look of startled surprise on the faces of so many who have struggled for years to make things work , and in a moment I make so many things clear to them. In my hands, I have them begin to understand how to do these things, about the use of their own bodies. Nor have you seen the anger and sense of betrayal from their years of struggle- when in an afternoon I have them doing aiki no jutsu of Daito ryu or kokyu of aikido in efficient ways they thought not possible. In short that their skills shot up immediately, and with the beginnings of an understanding of the pieces.
It is THEE reason you hear no one. NOT ONE who has trained here either countering me or agreeing with you. Why Eric? It's not arrogance. It's honesty of purpose and training. Because I share with a blatant honesty and openness that has an immediate impact on peoples skills and understanding or their given art. and it goes uphill from there. With all due respect you simply do not know what you are talking about. Either with what I know, how I share it, nor what happens when I do.

Erick Mead wrote: View Post
Point being, Ueshiba's aiki points even beyond that One ans singular poiont -- to the Numberless, the Nameless. Takemusu Aiki. The road from Ten Thousand to Three, and then Two and then One -- and then -- Not Then... Dan is correct that the One is a thing to be attained ( fr. L. attingere -- "to touch, to arrive at,"). Dan is wrong that it is to be attained in only one way - or that one way is necessarily better than another when it is not in accord with one's nature. Dan is wrong if he means that the One is a thing to be grasped, possessed, or a place in which to dwell. "I went to the rock to hide my face / But the rock cried out / No hiding place/ There's no hiding place / Down here." One must move on -- even from the One.

The Unnumbered Takemusu Aiki and the Ten Thousand techniques are not apart from one another -- but they are not the same, either. The mountain is again the mountain, the river again the river. But at a point it was both and This and Other, but neither of them. And then we moved on. This is the lesson of both Western Scripture and Fudo. At some point we all come down from the mountain. Even Moses came down from the mountain, and still was left to deal with the mess "down here" from which there is "no hiding."

That was and is Ueshiba's Aiki -- from the perspective of this particular One.
Well written, well constructed, total nonsense.
The trained body presents in/yo it is held tensions of the universe it is the connection in man that echoes with the fabric of all things. When we are in balance and others are not they are easily moved in accordance with their measure of balance in themselves. And even that is disrupted by a choice of will to attack and disrupt further. The reason strength is mentioned so much with Ueshiba, and point you and so many others are ill equipped to understand is that the strength is emblematic of the internal connection on several levels. It is a type of current and flow in a body unfamiliar and it is the contact with it that is highly disruptive of others efforts.
To that end, the one with the internal strength of Aikido does not blend and need to match to move others, he simply exists and moves. His will predominates while not resisting at all. Learning it from ten years or ten thousand techniques is simply the saddest, most staggeringly stupid way to learn it imaginable. And it is thee reason many martial artists suck and can't really fight worth beans, and the remainder are merely good technical fighters.
Neither captured or understand the true power potential in us all.
Those that do know- know there are faster ways to get there. And there are real experts who can do so

Last edited by DH : 06-04-2007 at 01:44 PM.
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