View Single Post
Old 03-30-2007, 02:45 PM   #30
George S. Ledyard
George S. Ledyard's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Eastside
Location: Bellevue, WA
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,670
Re: Poll: How important is working with strong-gripped, "static grabs" in your aikido

Christian Moses wrote: View Post
How do you reconcile this opinion with the historical role of grabs within nihon jujutsu, specifically where uke's grab is an attempt to immobilize tori's limbs so as to keep them from using or deploying a weapon? Wouldn't that be martial application?
Absolutely, I must have been unclear about what I meant. Usually, in the old stuff when you immobilized his ability to access his weapon there would also be some attempted restructuring of his alignment if possible. they just didn't run up and grab you sword hand and stand there. The grabbing method I attempted to describe would accomplish this in a traditional context just as it would in the more modern context.

Certainly one could argue that in our modern society this isn't relevant, but in your police tactics, surely you address the idea of a strong attacker attempting to impede an officer from deploying a weapon or getting to their radio. I know this is a very important part of the more LEO specific aspects of what we do that came from Bernie Lau.
Once again, absolutely no question. It's very useful to train with folks who are simply using just plain brute force because you will certainly encounter them. If your technique is good it isn't a problem. But I don't think we want our own people training to think that is an effective attack. It is how an untrained person attacks. I think we should be training that the attacker and the defender are using precisely the same principles. In other words I can accomplish the same thing and be far more relaxed and far more effective.

The dynamics and specifics involved are very similar to traditional applications that I've found in Shindo Yoshin ryu or Yanagi Ryu (just as examples). I agree with a lot of what you wrote there, and hope that it's clear that when (as I mentioned earlier) think "strong grab" I am not thinking of muscular pressure purely from the hands, but a full body grab to immobilize nage's ability to move, much like you describe.
Yes, again. Having trained with both Yanagi Ryu and Shindo Ryu folks, what they do is what I meant to say. I perhaps just didn't say it clearly. When Toby Threadgill grabs you, you don't see him white knuckling the grab nor is he grunting with effort. But he grabs yo with his whole body right from the hara. His attack is just that more effective because he grabs that way.

Anyway, sorry about mis-communicating what I meant.

George S. Ledyard
Aikido Eastside
Bellevue, WA
Aikido Eastside
  Reply With Quote