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Old 03-21-2007, 01:59 AM   #77
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Dojo: Aikido of Northern Virginia
Location: Stuttgart, Baden Wurttemberg
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,376
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Re: Shihan vs Fighters

Stan,

I don't understand why you will throw out things like this topic, judge people and the art they study by some standard that you will not define. You have no record or reputation here that we know about, and then when confronted directly on the issue, it is up to me to "come find out"!

I need a little more than a few post on the internet and a little bit better idea concernng the criteria you are talking about.

It could run the gamut from simple drills like unbendable arm, kokyu drills/exercises from a semi static position....to all out non-compliance.

Which is why I ask for a definition of the criteria in which such a venue or training event would take place. It is definiable. Any training that I do or people ask me to do, I always define the task, conditions, and the standards prior to that event taking place.

Here are two sets of rules that would be a good starting point for discussion about such a set of parameters in which to judge how an internal guy and a "guy that does not get it"./non-shihan albeit, could meet on common ground and demonstrate the fighting that you have yet to define.

Pancrase rules are decent as they allow for striking and kicking, but are restrictive enough to ensure someone does not get hurt seriously. I also wear Blauer suits or the like during such training. Of course we could modify the standards of these rules as necessary. (Personally I don't think strikes and kicks are necessary to demonstrate fighting effectiveness, but some people throw that in there as too limiting.

http://www.pancrase.co.jp/en/rules/index.html#009

NAGA graplling rules are decent. I prefer them over standard BJJ rules. No strikes, kicks, put pretty much anything else goes. I recommend leaving out knee bars etc as they are too dangerous, however things like kotegaeshi are fine I think.

http://nagafighter.com/naga_rules.asp

Let me know what you think about the rules set! Maybe the Shodukan Aikido rules are decent for this? I don't know having never seen them before.

Note in the rules that it does not say anywhere that you cannot use aikido techniques or aikido anything, so any one would be free to use anything that they have learned over the years in aikido.

I think this is a good start for discussion over the criteria upon which an event could be conducted safely, constructively, and in which those of us that really care how an internalist has to bring to the table in a non-compliant venue.

Of course we could also slow things down a little too once proficiency has been demonstrated in a particular way so as to isolate out the training objectives so everyone can see, experience what it is that is being effectively done.

I am not talking about a "my dad can beat up your dad" event or a dojo challenge. I am talking about an alive, constructive event in which the ability to apply concepts and principles can be demonstrated in a way that approximates reality as best we can safely.

It can be done, I do it all the time.

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