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Old 02-27-2002, 01:08 PM   #6
Chuck.Gordon
Location: Frederick, MD
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 509
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Re: Hidden secrets/ Dear chuck

Re: Hidden secrets/ Dear chuck

quote:
Originally posted by Bruce Baker

Hi Bruce,

>Obviously, you have taken the moral
>highground with doing your homework.

Eh? _Moral_ high ground? No clue what you're talking about.

>Do yourself a favor, Go to a Dillman
>pressure point seminar and tell me you can't
>knock out someone with pressure points,
>sound, or KI?

Never been to a Dillman seminar, but I have trained with one of his teachers, Oyata Seiyu (who I think calls himself Taika these days?). And no, I'm not particularly impressed with pressure point knockouts. They wrok very well on some folks, but they do not work on all people all the time. Period.

That said, in my dojo, we do study and use kyusho. But it's not an end unto itself.

>Study these things, do these things ... as I
>have done and I am doing now ... then tell
>me if I was smoke and mist?

I have. I've been doing budo for almost 30 years now. If it's a concept found in Japanese budo, I've probably poked at it, tried it, played with it, studied it, and usually, I come back to the basics. Train, study, train, study, train, study.

>Get with the program. Before you comment on
>something, study it, question it, learn all
>you can about it, then you can make >judgements.

Program? What program?

I'm not making judgements. You are. You're taking 'the moral high ground' by saying that folks who don't cotton to your ideas of what aikido should be are doing less than the pure aikido. That's both judgemental and arrogant.

I know folks doing great aikido who wouldn't give you a nickel for ki or kotodama. I know folks doing great aikido for whom ki is cornerstone of their training. Want to talk about Ki? A close friend of mine was the late George Simcox, rokudan in the Ki Society and head of the Virginia Ki Society. I maintain close contact today with some of his students. We spent many an hour on the mat together and more talking over dinner or beers. My own teacher trained with Tohei Koichi many years ago as well.

I regularly train with and hang out with folks from Yoshinkan, USAF East (some of your dojo's shihan's folks, by the way) and West regions, from the ASU and more. All of 'em are doing good, valid aikido, some of 'em are doing wonderful aikido and promise to be great aikido teachers some day (some of 'em already are).

As far as sound being a tool, as I said, I've studied kiaijutsu and teach it in my dojo. And it's a useful tool, but it's not the core of the art or the central facet of what we do.

>Dillman pressure point, is not the purest of
>sources, but Master George Dillman is

This is the same George Dillman who used to do Goju Ryu karate, back in the 70s, yes? A student of Peter Urban if I remember correectly. With whom (besides Oyata) has he trained lately? Not being argumentative here, just asking. I knew who he was back then, but haven't kept up with his career at all.

>Study Chin-Na, Jwing-Ming Yang has a good
>series of learning for this.

Whyever for? Japanese budo has more depths than I'll ever be able to plumb fully. I did some Pa Kua and some Kali and some JKD and Tang Soo Do back when I was younger, but over the years, I discovered that I can only devote so much time to training and therefore concentrated on the Japanese budo rather than haring all over the place trying to do a little of this and a little of that.

>When you have disproven all this by doing as
>much as you can, then you will begin to see
>what has been hidden.

I don't have to disprove anything. You can chase these things all you want. I don't care. But please be a little more polite about telling other folks that what they're doing isn't the One True Way. Sheesh. There IS no One True Way.

I don't like ALL aikido (I don't teach aikido by the way, I'm a student of jujutsu and study aikido as an adjunct to my own core curriculum), but I recognize the value of what aikido is and what it offers. And I recognize the value of the viewpoints held by others and try hard to respect them.

>Most people do a very nice Kata, but don't
>truly understand what it means?

Which kata are you talking about? Okinawan empty-hand stuff? I don't even do that kind of kata (but I do practice koryu-style kata for various weapons and empty-hand forms).

Here's an EXCELLENT source for research into the true meanings of Okinawan karate forms:

http://www.24fightingchickens.com/s...kata/index.html

>Aikido does not kill, but what are the
>hidden meanings? Pressure points.

As I said, study of kyusho is fundamental in all Japanese budo. It's part and parcel, but certainly not the apparently mystical gateway to truth some folks would have us believe.

>Do your research, then get back to me.
>Until then, stop spreading tall tales.

Man oh man. No clue what you're on about, but I'm not the one spreading tall tales here.

You appear to have some huge issue with me, and that's fine, though puzzling, but let's try to keep this civil, shall we?

Chuck

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