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Old 11-23-2005, 06:02 PM   #10
George S. Ledyard
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Dojo: Aikido Eastside
Location: Bellevue, WA
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,670
Re: Aikido against judo

Keane Lee wrote:
I understand what you are implying and i shldent be over concern abt the whole self defense thing.But i don't understand why Tohei sensei and his students can defend themselves against judo practioners but i cant?it has got to do with my training right?i really need alil help here.Need to know whats wrong...
Ok, here goes... Those guys could do that stuff because they trained one piss load harder than most people train today. They trained morning, noon, and night under the direct supervision of the Founder. Most of the deshi also did other martial arts, many judo, and had a solid martial arts foundation before they ever got on the mat to do Aikido.

How long have you trained? How many hours a day, how many times a week? Does your teacher even address issues like Judo style attacks? I've seen the films of Tohei doing a demo against a wrestler and what he did was essentially atemi waza. Since it was friendly he kind of just slapped him around and eveded his attempts to get a hold on Tohei until Tohei could snag something to execute a technique on. I'll bet you haven't practiced that in the dojo, am I right?

The guys in the thirties got a much more martially oriented training than what was later done after the war. Japan was gearing up for war and the need to be able to fight was on everyone's minds. Many of the deshi ended up using their art in combat in various ways, Tohei included. Have you been in combat? I suspect not.

What I am saying is that these guys trained for application. They were mostly combat veterans by the time the war ended. Their mindset was different than yours and their training was different than yours. Most of these guys were sent overseas to introduce Aikido around the world. They were expected to be able to handle themselves because they couldn't afford to have the new art be embarrased, otherwise no one would take it seriously. These boys could mambo.

If you want to be like that you have to train like that. If defeating Judo practitioners is your goal in training then you darned well need to get together with a bunch of Judo guys and work out. I suspect that you aren't very senior in this art and you may not be able to puzzle out how to apply the amount you know against people who train every day against resistant opponents. You will then need to go to someone quite a bit more experienced than you are and ask them to help you develop technique designed to defeat Judoka. You may have trouble finding anyone who is willing to spend time with you for such a limited and seemingly irrelevant purpose but maybe not... I don't think I'd bother but that's just me...

Or you can train for a very long time, very hard and actually acheive some mastery of traditional Aikido technique. At that point you will probably be able to see how you would apply your deep understanding of technqiue and principle against a Judoka, should you still have any interest in doing so at that point...

Look, I am familiar with this issue. We all know that the old guys, including O-Sensei, could handle challengers from all sorts of styles... I acknowledge that very few people these days are doing their Aikido in such a way that they will acheive that level of technical ability. Find an Aikido teacher who is Shihan level and train like crazy, do some other martial arts to give your Aikido context, in other words train like the people you are referencing and you will learn what you wish to know. If the issue is beating a Judoka, sneak up behind him with a club and beat him over the head. If you wish to defeat him with your Aikido then you need to train with a teacher who has that capability, and train as hard and as frequently as the folks of old who could do these things. It's all in there but you have to find it.

Last edited by George S. Ledyard : 11-23-2005 at 06:08 PM.

George S. Ledyard
Aikido Eastside
Bellevue, WA
Aikido Eastside
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