Oh, I've had the aches, pains and bruises, believe me - that's not what I meant though.
I've met some very good aikidoka and also some pathetic ones as well. We all have. Too many of the latter is the problem!
With regrads to inflicting unecessary pain or even causing damage (which I'm sure you didn't mean
), I've seen that in karate too. Didn't impress me there either.