Michael Gallagher wrote:
It all depends on what you want from the art and what works for you, which seems to be a reason why there's so much variation in Aikido in the first place! There are people who are perfectly happy doing it for spiritual and philospohical reasons and not interested in hardcore training on the techniques like you descirbe. Does that mean those individuals would be pushovers on the street? I have no idea. But can their training methods be called mediocre if they are going where they want to go with it? It may be mediocre from one persepctive, perfect from another.
Aikido seems to allow for people to come to it for a variety of reasons and stick with it for a variety of goals and objectives. Since I'm a newbie at Aikido, my goal is just to get the hang of it! So calling someone "medicore" because they're not purusing the same path you are may not be entirely fair. And who knows? Maybe those ultra copperative types could tie us both in knots and not even know we were there.
I understand your position.
Now please understand that you are not understanding mine. Your last post proves that, and it's cool.
If you looked at the name of the thread and the general points of conversation you will hopefully see that the word "martial" and "spontaneous" are very prevalent. This means that this thread is not designed to marginalise or put down those who practice Aikido for the myriad of other reasons that exist. In fact it does not even address them. The topic of the thread is specifically targeted towards "martially effective" Aikido and understanding the depths of how the Aiki concepts operate in a truly martial context without resorting prematurely to methods outside of that contained within the Aikido and Aiki paradigm.
So just to recap, I have no problem with those who do Aikido for philosophical, spiritual, social, medical or whatever other word ending in "al" that one can find, except for the word "martial'. The culture of mediocrity (which is different to calling someone a mediocre Aikidoka who does not train martially, which I am not doing) that we are speaking about is with regard to those persons who seek to apply it in serious martial situations and who are trying to understand the depths o f applying Aiki as a sound martial paradigm.
Thus I would appreciate it if you not try to make me appear as if I am trying to label as "mediocre" those who are not training in Aikido for martially effective reasons. I have no problem with their training at all. If they feel mediocre in what they do then I don't think it is from something I have said here but maybe a reflection of the self.
I hope you understand now. This thread is not really for those who are not training Aikido with a martially effective goal in mind. I don't think it can get much simpler than that.