Thread: Aikido Works
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Old 05-27-2005, 11:06 AM   #71
Dojo: Finger Lakes Aikido
Location: Cortland, NY
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 977
Re: Aikido Works

Michael Neal wrote:
Its not too bad for me, it is too bad for the Aikido people who injure themselves because they can't take ukemi. And its too bad for all the Aikidoka who can not learn how to do a simple hip throw because there classmates can't take the fall. It impedes the learning process.
This hinges on your assumption that Judo-style hip throws are a fundamental technique to many martial arts and you can not do anything without them. I'm sorry, but that is not true.

In the past twenty years, I have done two styles of Aikido (including what I am doing now), two styles of Karate, one style of Kali, one style of Wing Chun, one Indonesian system, and I have "switched" styles of Tai Chi because someone else is taking over the class I'm in. I have seen, and on the business end of, a great many throws. There are throws you can argue are hip throws because it is used as a fulcrum, but the only time prior to Aikido where I saw anything resembleming Koshi Nage, where uke is actually picked up and dumped off nage's back, was in Shotokan class where we did the setup for that, and that was introduced as a throw from Judo, not something fundamental to Shotokan. Meaning it is not a basic Shotokan technique. And my sensei had, at that time, 4th degree black belts in Shotokan and TKD, so I'd think he'd know if it was in the syllabus or not.

I'm sorry, but based on my experience, your argument that koshi nage and its Judo equivelants are a fundamental technique all arts need does not hold water, because I have seen many arts and it is NOT a basic technique in them. And if Aikido suffers in your eyes because Koshi Nage is not the first thing you learn in Aikido, then God only knows how horrible damn near anything else looks when they don't do it at all.

But at least knocking down straw men is good exercise, so keep it up!
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