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Old 04-15-2005, 03:54 PM   #14
Mike Sigman
Location: Durango, CO
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,123
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Re: Shioda, Tohei, and Ki Things

Quote:
Ron Tisdale wrote:
Ah, not quite, I remembered both that and the different powers coming together. But our conversations may be leading me in a slightly different direction, which is good..
Speaking of different directions, I found a number of comments by Shioda that describe things in ways I would not necessarily describe them, but I know pretty much what he's talking about. It's like an observation I've tried to make a couple of times... there is a certain logic to these things, particularly in regard to the basic principles. So if two people are using different terminology but they understand the basic principles, there should be a fairly quick arrival at a common dialogue.

Tohei's ki tests, etc., are pretty much in line with common ki/qi things, but from what I've seen they seem to be at a fairly basic level (which is, of course, a good level from which to start people). Because I've been able to observe Shioda on DVD and read his far more explicative thoughts on how things work, I have a lot better idea about what he did, how he moved, etc. As I said, I have to re-think my ideas about how sophisticated the Japanese understanding of ki and kokyu things are, but I'd reaffirm my opinion that the kokyu seen in Aikido is what I would call "linear" (even if it's used circularly at times) and everything appears to have evolved from Shaolin-type use of qi and jin (of course, quotations from O-Sensei pretty much confirm that impression).

But to get to the point I want to make from the background in the above paragraph, it is my *impression* that the ki usage in Tohei shows in his ki tests was pretty much understood by Shioda. Of course the use of "focused power" by Shioda means that he could easily have withstood the pushes, etc., just as the ki tests show. The question would have been some of the techniques that cause the body to "connect" within itself.... and Shioda refers to a way the body "locks" (see pages 85-86 in "Aikido Shugyo") which sounds like the same idea, as Shioda describes it. The general point I'm making once again is that although there are variations, I don't see any real difference between the Aikido that Tohei himself did and the Aikido that Shioda did. Nor do I see anything but confirmation about how important these ki and kokyu skills are to the practice of Aikido. My opinion, of course.

FWIW

Mike
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