AikiWeb Aikido Forums

AikiWeb Aikido Forums (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/index.php)
-   General (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=1)
-   -   Who said this? (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567)

Jim23 02-08-2001 06:28 PM

Anyone know who wrote this?

Immovable Elbow Theory

It is important when assuming the bi-jong that the elbow of your lead arm remain immovable. With your elbow in a fixed position approximately three inches in front of your body, youÕll note that your hand and forearm are free to move in any direction. If you envision a rectangle that has been stood on itÕs end, with itÕs bottom boundary being your groin area, itÕs top boundary being your eyebrows, and itÕs remaining two sides being each of your respective shoulders, you will understand the parameters of movement Š up and down and sideways Š that your arms can travel. Further imagine that there is an invisible perpendicular line that intersects your elbow. If your lead arm is pressed, hold to the core or centerline. Do not give it up, even it if means your entire body must move, and never allow your elbows to dip below your navel.

----

Circle With No Circumference

......, ultimately, is not a matter of petty technique but of highly developed personal spirituality and physique. It is not a question of developing what has already been developed but of recovering what has been left behind. These things have been with us, in us, all the time and have never been lost or distorted except by our misguided manipulation of them. ....... is not a matter of technology but of spiritual insight and training.

The tools are at an undifferentiated center of a circle that has no circumference, moving and yet not moving, in tension and yet relaxed, seeing everything happening and yet not at all anxious about its outcome, with nothing purposely designed, nothing consciously calculated, no anticipation, no expectation -- in short, standing innocently like a baby and yet, with all the cunning, subterfuge and keen intelligence of a fully mature kind.

Leave sagehood behind and enter once more into ordinary humanity. After coming to understand the other side, come back and live on this side. After the cultivation of no-cultivation, one's thoughts continue to be detached from phenomenal things and one still remains amid the phenomenal, yet devoid of the phenomenal.

Both the man and his surroundings ate eliminated. Then, neither the man nor his surroundings ate eliminated. Walk on!

One can never be the master of his technical knowledge unless all his psychic hindrances are removed and he can keep his mind in a state of emptiness (fluidity), even purged of whatever technique he has obtained.

With all the training thrown to the wind, with a mind perfectly unaware of its own working, with the self vanishing nowhere, anybody knows where, the art of ...o attains its perfection.

The more aware you become, the more you shed from day to day what you have learned so that your mind is always fresh and uncontaminated by previous conditioning. Learning techniques corresponds to an intellectual apprehension of the philosophies in Zen, and in both Zen and ....., an intellectual proficiency does not cover the whole ground of the discipline. Both require the attainment of ultimate reality, which is the emptiness or the absolute. The latter transcends all modes of relativity.

In ....., all technique is to be forgotten and the unconscious is to be left alone to handle the situation. The technique will assert its wonders automatically or spontaneously. To float in totality, to have no technique, is to have all technique. The knowledge and skill you have achieved ate meant to be '"forgotten" so you can float comfortably in emptiness, without obstruction. Learning is important but do not become its slave. Above all, do not harbor anything external and superfluous -- the mind is primary. Any technique, however worthy and desirable, becomes a disease when the mind is obsessed with it.

The six diseases:

1.The desire for victory.
2.The desire to resort to technical cunning.
3.The desire to display all that has been learned.
4.The desire to awe the enemy.
5.The desire to play the passive role.
6.The desire to get rid of whatever disease one is affected by .

"'To desire" is an attachment. "'To desire not to desire" is also an attachment. To be unattached then, means to be free at once from both statements, positive and negative. This is to be simultaneously both "yes" and "no," which is intellectually absurd. However, not so in Zen.

Nirvana is to be consciously unconscious or to be unconsciously conscious. That is its secret. The act is so direct and immediate that intellectualization finds no room to insert itself and cut the act to pieces.

The spirit is no doubt the controlling agent of our existence. This invisible seat controls every movement in whatever external situation arises. It is thus, to be extremely mobile, never "stopping" in any place at any moment. Preserve this state of spiritual freedom and non-attachment as soon as you assume the fighting stance. Be "master of the house."

It is the ego that stands rigidly against influences from the outside, and it is this "ego rigidity" that makes it impossible for us to accept everything that confronts us.

Art lives where absolute freedom is, because where it is not, there can be no creativity.

Seek not the cultivated innocence of a clever mind that wants to be innocent, but have rather that state of innocence where there is no denial or acceptance and the mind just sees what its.

All goals apart from the means are illusions. Becoming is a denial of being. By an error repeated throughout the ages, truth, becoming a law or a faith, places obstacles in the way of knowledge. Method, which is in its very substance ignorance, encloses truth within a vicious circle. We should break such a circle, not by seeking knowledge, but by discovering the cause of ignorance.

Recollection and anticipation are fine qualities of consciousness that distinguish the human mind from that of the lower animals. But, when actions are directly related to the problem of life and death, these properties must be relinquished for the sake of fluidity of thought and lightning rapidity of action.

Action is our relationship to everything. Action is not a matter of right and wrong. It is only when action is partial that there is a right and a wrong.

Don't let your attention be attested! Transcend dualistic comprehension of a situation.

Give up thinking as though not giving it up. Observe the techniques as though not observing. Utilize the art as a means to advance in the study of the Way.

A concentrated mind is not an attentive mind, but a mind that is in the state of aware- ness can concentrate. Awareness is never exclusive; it includes everything.

Not being tense but ready, not thinking yet not dreaming, not being set but flexible - it is being wholly and quietly alive, aware and alert, ready for whatever may come.

The ... man should be on the alert to meet the interchangeability of opposites. As soon as his mind "stops" with either of them, it loses its own fluidity. A ... man should keep his mind always in the state of emptiness so that his freedom in action will never be obstructed.

The abiding stage is the point where the mind hesitates to abide. It attaches itself to an object and stops the flow.

The deluded mind is the mind effectively burdened by intellect. Thus, it cannot move without stopping and reflecting on itself. This obstructs its native fluidity.

The wheel revolves when it is not too tightly attached to the axle. When the mind is tied up, it feels inhibited in every move it makes and nothing is accomplished with spontaneity. Its work will be of poor quality or it may never be finished at all.

When the mind is tethered to a center, naturally it is not free. It can move only within the limits of that center. If one is isolated, he is dead; he is paralyzed within the fortress of his own ideas.

When you ate completely aware, there is no space for a conception, a scheme, "the opponent and I;" there is complete abandonment.

When there is no obstruction, the ... man's movements ate like flashes of lightning or like the mirror reflecting images.

When insubstantiality and substantiality ate not set and defined, when there is no track to change what is, one has mastered the formless form. When there is clinging to form, when there is attachment of the mind, it is not the true path. When technique comes out of itself, that is the way.

... is the art not founded on techniques or doctrine. It is just as you are. When there is no center and no circumference, then there is truth. When you freely express, you are the total style.

Jim23

Jim23 02-08-2001 07:37 PM

Another hint:

Art is the expression of the self. The more complicated and restrictive a method is, the lesser the opportunity for the expression of oneÕs original sense of freedom!

The techniques, though they play an important role in the early stage, should not be too restrictive, complex, or mechanical. If we cling to them we will become bound by their limitations. Remember, you are expressing the technique and not doing the technique.

When someone attacks you it is not technique number one (or is it technique number two, stance two, section four?) that you are doing, but the moment you become aware of his attacks you simply move in like sound and echo without any deliberation.

It is as though when I call you, you answer me or when I throw something to you, you catch it, that all.

Jim23

Jim23 02-08-2001 07:48 PM

Come on, take a guess.

Another hint:

The phenomenon of "no-mindedness," is not a blank mind that shuts out all thoughts and emotions; nor is it simply calmness and quietness of mind.

Although quiettude and calmness are necessary, it is the "non-graspingness" of thoughts that mainly constitutes the principle of no mind. A .... man employs his mind as a mirror Š it grasps nothing and refuses nothing; it receives but does not keep. As Allen Watts puts it, the no-mindedness is:

* A state of wholeness in which the mind functions freely and easily, without the sensation of a mind or ego standing over it with a club.

Therefore, concentration in ..... does not have the usual sense of restricting the attention to a single sense object, but is simply a quiet awareness of whatever happens to be here and now.

Such concentration can be illustrated by an audience at a football game; instead of a concentrated attention on the player that has the ball, they have an awareness of the whole football field.

In a similar way, a .... manÕs mind is concentrated by not dwelling on any particular part of the opponent. This is especially true when dealing with many opponents. For instance, suppose ten men are attacking him, each in succession ready to strike him down. As soon as one is disposed of, he will move on to another without permitting the mind to stop with any. However rapidly one blow may follow another, he leaves no time to intervene between the two.

Every one of the ten will thus be successively and successfully dealt with. This is possible only when the mind moves from one object to another without being stopped or arrested by anything. If the mind is unable to move on in this fashion, it is sure to lose the combat somewhere between two encounters.

Jim23

mj 02-09-2001 11:12 AM

Hi Jim23, if you're asking who wrote those things, wasn't it the monk Takuan? Mark Johnston

Jim23 02-09-2001 11:16 AM

Nope.

Actually I shouldn't say that as, I don't know who he is and what he said.

So, you could be right.

Jim23

mj 02-09-2001 11:29 AM

Well, I'm not 100% sure, cos I don't have the literature myself, but some of it is exactly as it was written in the book 'Letters of the monk Takuan' translated by Dr Suzuki, I think, but I don't have the book. But I know who else said it... !
Mark J

Jim23 02-09-2001 11:37 AM

Good. Don't say who.

Let's see if anyone can guess.

Jim23

mj 02-09-2001 12:02 PM

what's the deal with http://www.seikeikan.com/image/kungfu.gif?


chrisinbrasil 02-09-2001 12:11 PM

I guess the guy on the right felt threatened enough. hehehe It could happen to us if we go ballistic too! :laugh:

Jim23 02-09-2001 12:36 PM

I just found it funny. Probably because of the way it was drawn. Haha!

It is silly though - perhaps I am too.

Jim23

lt-rentaroo 02-09-2001 01:22 PM

Jim,

I'm not sure who wrote what you quoted, but much of it sounds exactly like Bruce Lee's theories concerning Jeet Kun Do. Of course, I could be way off in left field with that.

mj 02-09-2001 01:59 PM

.....? We are talking about the pic that only has some text - modern art martial art - at the top left hand corner, right? Have I been conned?
mj

Jim23 02-09-2001 02:02 PM

Hey Louis,

Not saying who yet.


Another hint:

The common mistake most people make is to identify this Yin/Yang symbol as dualistic; that is Yang being the opposite of Yin, and vice versa. As long as we separate this "oneness" into two, we won't achieve realization. Actually, all things have their complementary part; it is only in the human mind and his perception that they are being separated into opposites. The sun is not the opposite of the moon, as they complement and are interdependent on each other, and we cannot survive without either of them. In a similar way, a male is but the complement of the female; for without the male, how on earth do we know there is female, or vice versa. The "oneness" of Yin/Yang is necessary in life. If a persona riding a bicycle wishes to go somewhere, he cannot pump on both the pedals at the same time or not pumping on them at all. In order to move forward, he has to pump one pedal and release the other. So the movement of going forward requires this "oneness" of pumping and releasing. Pumping then is the result of releasing, and vice versa; each being the cause of the other.

In the Yin/Yang symbol there is a white spot on the black part, and black spot on the white one. This is to illustrate the balance in life, for nothing can survive long by going to either extremes, be it negativeness or positiveness. Therefore, firmness must be concealed in gentleness, and gentleness firmness, and that is why a ... man must be pliable as spring. Notice that the stiffest tree is most easily cracked, while the bamboo will bend with the wind. So in ..., or any other system, one must be gentle yet not giving away completely; be firm yet not hard, and even if he is strong, he should guard it with softness and tenderness. For if there is no softness in firmness, he is not strong; in a similar way, if one has firmness concealed in softness, no one can break through his defense. This principle of moderation provides a best means of preserving oneself, for since we accept this existence of the oneness (Yin/Yang) in everything, and do not treat it dualistically, we thus secure a state of tranquillity by remaining detached and not inclining to either extreme. Even if we do incline on one extreme, be it negative or positive, we will flow with it in order to control it. This flowing with it without clinging is the true way to get ride of it.

When the movements in Yin/Yang flow into extremes, reaction sets in. For when Yang goes to the extreme, it changes to Yin; and when Yin (activated by Yang) goes to the extreme, it returns back to Yang (that is why each one is the result and cause of the other.) For example, when one works to the extreme, he becomes tired and has to rest (from Yang to Yin). This incessant changing of Yin/Yang is always continuous.

The application of the theory of Yin/Yang in ... is known as the Law of Harmony, in which one should be in harmony with, and not against the force of the opponent. Suppose A applies strength on B, B shouldn't oppose or give way completely to it. For these are but the two extreme opposites of B's reaction. Instead, he should complete A's force, with a lesser force, and lead him to the direction of his own movement. As the butcher preserves his knife by cutting along the bone and not against it, a ... man preserves himself by following the movement of his opponent without opposition or even striving (Wu-Wai, spontaneous, or spirit action). This spontaneous assisting of A's movement as he aims it, will result in his own defeat.

When a ... man finally understands the theory of Yin/Yang, he no longer "fusses" with so-called "gentleness" or "firmness"; he simply does what the movement requires him to do. In fact his movements are those of everyday movements. He doesn't have to "justify" himself like so many other masters have, claiming his spirit or his internal power; to him, cultivation of martial art in the long run will return to simplicity, and only people of half-way cultivation justify and brag about themselves.

Jim23

Dan Hover 02-09-2001 02:05 PM

bruce Lee Tao of jeet Kune do?

cbrf4zr2 02-09-2001 02:24 PM

Jim,

I'm not sure why the big secret.

Here's Jim:
"Ooooh...I found this article, failed to format it nicely and posted it to Aikweb..(hooray for me!)...and now I want people to guess who wrote it. But even when they do guess, I'm just going to keep it all to myself."

Here's me:
"Why the big guessing game? I was hoping to run into 2nd Kyu's and 2nd Dan's on this board, not 2nd graders."

Next time, if it's interesting, give credit, post it and let people read it. After reading through many of the threads you've been involved with, I get the impression you just like to see your name "up in lights."

Ed

Jim23 02-09-2001 02:45 PM

Quote:

cbrf4zr2 wrote:


Here's Jim:
"Ooooh...I found this article, failed to format it nicely and posted it to Aikweb..(hooray for me!)...and now I want people to guess who wrote it. But even when they do guess, I'm just going to keep it all to myself."

Here's me:
"Why the big guessing game? I was hoping to run into 2nd Kyu's and 2nd Dan's on this board, not 2nd graders."

Ed

Now this is totally uncalled for and I'm not going to even bother to give you the satisfaction of an answer.

Jim23

Dan Hover 02-09-2001 02:46 PM

that's mature

akiy 02-09-2001 02:46 PM

http://www.junfanjkd.com/immoveable.htm
http://www.jitsu.taffynet.co.uk/bruce/circle.htm
http://user.exit.mytoday.de/dragon/gung_fu.html
http://www.junfanjkd.com/wuhsin.htm
http://www.junfanjkd.com/basic.htm

-- Jun

Jim23 02-09-2001 02:56 PM

You're right.

This thread is offically terminated - hey, I can't say that that's Jun's job.

Ed must be happy now.

Jim23

Gray Fox 02-14-2001 03:52 PM

sigh...human evolution takes another step back

Well, as far as I can see, that was the most mature move on Jim's part. I mean, we can all use a little entertainment or a game now and then. Besides, there was no harm in Jim's post, so why make a big deal about it? Even if what you mentioned was the real reason he posted it...who cares? If the man enjoys seeing his name up in the forums, let him see it...no harm to you is there? Maybe the real reason you posted the reply was to see your name "up in lights"...oh great, now I'm doing it.


[Edited by Gray Fox on February 14, 2001 at 04:16pm]

Nick 02-14-2001 07:07 PM

I believe that if you want to see your name "up in lights", Aikido is not the place to do it... much more would have been learned and better discussions would have been had if he had simply posted the quotes and asked our opinions and comments of them, and this whole "controversy" would not have started, but rather a thoughtful and intelligent discussion about some interesting topics.

Nick

Jim23 02-14-2001 08:31 PM

m(_ _)m

Jim23 02-14-2001 08:54 PM

I think we all take ourselves too seriously.

Seriously.

No offence Nick, I meant everyone.

Jim23

m(_ _)m

Erik 02-14-2001 10:53 PM

Quote:

Nick wrote:
I believe that if you want to see your name "up in lights", Aikido is not the place to do it...
It's worked for Steven Seagal. Hey, his new movie is coming out in March and it's got Tom Arnold in it so there's hope.

Quote:

much more would have been learned and better discussions would have been had if he had simply posted the quotes and asked our opinions and comments of them, and this whole "controversy" would not have started, but rather a thoughtful and intelligent discussion about some interesting topics.
Nick, you definitely take yourself way too seriously. Sometimes you just say "who gives a f***" and get a little crazy. Aikidoists as a group seem to get so wrapped up in being perfect little PC critters that we don't say what we feel but what we think we are supposed to say. The world won't tilt on it's axis because we burned up a few k of hard drive space.

Gray Fox 02-15-2001 04:12 PM


Really guys, lighten up a bit. After all, this is the general forum, not everything has to be a brain busting topic here. Grab a drink, sit back, relax and enjoy. If you don't want to relax, or just dont like the subject...DONT READ.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:56 AM.

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.