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-   -   Eye injuries (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=506)

sharon 01-18-2001 11:45 AM

I recently caught an elbow with my left eye when I collided with one of the ukes. There's no damage to the vision, only mechanical damage (which is very visible) In view of this accident I'm thinking of getting protective goggles, as I also wear contacts (I was when the accident happen and they did not aggrevate the injury). I was wondering how frequent eye injuries are in Aikido (I'm not talking about nose injuries that cause black eyes, I'm talking a direct hit on the eye-ball). Maybe there's a place to recommend contact users to use goggles. If you ever had such an injury or witnessed one, I'd like to collect some statistics.

Sharon

Guest5678 01-18-2001 12:54 PM

I don't have any stats for you but people in our dojo seem to take it in the eye once in a while as well. Just some info on using goggles, there is a guy in our dojo that has perscription sports goggles like the basketball players use. The only problem he has is when we do things like Iriminage with new people that tend to grab the whole side of your head unstead of using a pressure point. Other than that, he doesn't have an issue with them on the mat. btw... he's probably much safer wearing them while doing weapons work with me anyway! he-he-he! oh I see, just POINT the kissaki at their eye, don't actually PUT it in their eye! ok, I get it! HA!

Hey! heres a marketing idea, nerf bokkens! someone run with it!


Regards,

Dan P. - Mongo



Erik 01-18-2001 02:29 PM

I've caught one person in the eye and nearly got it myself with a jo. The jo was getting carried away on my part. The person I caught came in hard, I extended an open hand and they kept coming. We spent a few hours at the hospital after that. Fortunately all ended well.

I'm kind of surprised more people don't get it as I run into a surprising lack of atemi awareness at times. Guess they're unaware because they don't see much of them, so they don't practice atemi and also don't get hit. I guess this also means that the tree never fell in the forest.

lt-rentaroo 01-18-2001 02:35 PM

Yes, I've witnessed or taken part in an eye injury incident. Just recently, my wife and I were practicing some techniques. I was performing Katatekosatori Kokyunage (very similar to most Iriminage techniques) and while I was maintaining control of my wife's head and pivoting, I accidentally brought my "free" hand a little too close to her face and I ever so lightly (a love tap really) hit her just above her left eye. She had a bruised eye for about a week. I felt really bad, but I figure that we are even now because about a week earlier she was performing a Sankyo pin on me that led to some really bad bruises on the tricep portion of my right arm. We are usually very careful during practice and very seldom get injuries (knock on wood), so the recent injuries were the first ones in a very long time.

Matt Banks 01-18-2001 04:49 PM

Hi, I dont know how neccesary eye protection is. Your gonna get injuries if you train hard, I think its a fact of life. There was one guy who wore goggles over his glasses and he was nick named ''eddie the eagle'', he didnt mind.

You could say you need anal protection, cause a few times weve had uke's arse hole land on the end of the tip of a bokken. He was of for session but was back in action the next day. Hope it doesnt happen to me.

akiy 01-18-2001 05:05 PM

Back in December, I participated in a friend's nidan randori wherein I got smacked pretty hard in the left eye. (As he said, the sound of his fist hitting me in the video is "pretty alarming.) For the rest of the day, my vision was impaired with everything appearing "lighter" (ie brightness control turned up). My vision was impaired by being a bit blurry for a few days following, too. I wear hard contact lenses, too.

I dropped by an opthalmologist the next day and had the eye checked out. He said that although it looked like there was just swelling of the iris (irisitis?), he wanted to make sure that there wouldn't be any retinal problems (torn or detached retina) so he routed me to a retinal specialist. She took a look at it, dilated the pupil, poked around in my eye for a while, shined some really bright lights into it, and proclaimed it OK. I have a follow up appointment in February to make sure that the retina is doing OK.

Am I now wearing eye protection? No, and I'm not planning on doing so, either. I think such things depend on your own perspective in your training. If you feel like you would be better off with one, then you might want to wear one. As for me, the chance, I figure, of getting hit in the eye (from my own experience) is pretty minimal...

-- Jun

T'zur 01-18-2001 09:54 PM

eyes?!?!?
 
Huh, never heard of an eye injury before in Aikido, though I wouldn't rule it out. Since the face doesn't seem to be the focal point of many of our techniques (or any if you want to be technical about it, we are always attacking uke's center or hara) I have heard of lip, chin, even ear, but these were for the most part abrasions caused be uke's head being mauled over the surface of a rough gia. Nope, no eye stuff. There's my 2 cents.


Ebiri

Aikilove 01-19-2001 02:40 AM

I myself wear ordinary glasses and the only time I ever think of them is during iriminage, and even then I see how the partner is throwin (if the glasses is thrown of).
Accidents do happens, e.i some uke isn't reacting on an atemi as previusly mentioned, but you as nage and uke for that, is allways responsible for your partners safety. When we do jo training for example and our sensei see someone thrusting towards the throat he will go down on that person with thunder and lightening. Or if someone continue to apply pressure in a pin even if uke is clapping off. That can result in permanent wrist damage. We simply can never ever accept injurys of that kind, especially not in Aikido practice. That is ofcurse the standard we are applying in our club, but I believe it is a healthy one.

So be carefull during training, then you might be able to train with that partner a second time. ;)

ian 01-19-2001 07:17 AM

mmm - strange. I think if you're prepared to face a live blade, you should be prepared for some damage from hands and elbows.

I would feel that goggles give me an unreal perspective (due to distortion), and would it also make you worry about your eyes when someone attacked you in reality?

I think safety in training comes down to methods more than protective gear. For me, injuries are avoided by starting off slowly when doing technique, and doing it faster as you get used to it. Uke also has an obligation to look after themselves (or what else are ukemis for?), and really should be reacting to these 'atemis'.

The only thing I really worry about permanent eye injuries with is bokken work - especially when you swing back your bokken and someone is behind you. (same applies for jo I suppose). But this requires better spacing, not goggles.

Ian

akiy 01-19-2001 10:47 AM

Quote:

ian wrote:
mmm - strange. I think if you're prepared to face a live blade, you should be prepared for some damage from hands and elbows.
Who said anything about being prepared to face a live blade? I sure am not -- and I'm pretty sure that most (sane) people out there would say the same thing.
Quote:

The only thing I really worry about permanent eye injuries with is bokken work - especially when you swing back your bokken and someone is behind you. (same applies for jo I suppose). But this requires better spacing, not goggles.
One thing that I got from Obata sensei was that it's your responsibility to watch people behind your partner and to stop him or her if your partner's weapon is getting too near to someone else.

-- Jun

BC 01-19-2001 11:11 AM

[quote]akiy wrote:
[b]
Quote:

ian wrote:
mmm - strange. I think if you're prepared to face a live blade, you should be prepared for some damage from hands and elbows.
Who said anything about being prepared to face a live blade? I sure am not -- and I'm pretty sure that most (sane) people out there would say the same thing.
Also, I'm not studying aikido to be prepared for some damage from hands and elbows. I'm actually studying aikido (amongst other reasons) to avoid and prevent any damage to myself and my loved ones, be it from hands, elbows, feet, knees, etc...


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